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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 6:36 am 
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zt1903 wrote:
Rinkals wrote:
Thai guy wrote:
Rinkals wrote:
It's disheartening to see supposedly intelligent people trying to imbue a complete fuckwit like Donald Trump with some kind of super-intelligent strategy, when it's quite clear that he's completely out of his depth.
Who here has ever considered zt supposedly intelligent? :?

Well, I don't think he's quite as stupid as his continued defence of Trump implies.

The same goes for Santa and Sen. WT, however, is clearly in a class of his own.


Cheers. Thai guy on the other hand .......
Lol. You just thanked Rinkals for describing you as not quite as stupid as you appear.


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 6:56 am 
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theaxe wrote:
I’m still of the view that anyone on the bored who is on the Drumpf train is a troll. It’s just a shame that so many Americans who are actively getting f**ked over by him and his administration are so loyal to him. As I’ve said many times before Drumpf is a terrible human being and an even worse president.

It would be nice to think so.

I think someone like Sen is generally supportive of what Trump stands for even if he is aware that he isn't the right poster child for the project. I think that the various efforts to investigate Trump's business dealings and Russian links amuse him because of the way that liberals are invested in a process which is horribly complex because of the implications of the POTUS being a crook. Bear in mind that this is a man whom almost half of American voters voted for and, by extension approve of and pursuing him is questioning the legitimacy of their franchise, so it's for that reason that Mueller has to be thorough and has to be sure that his investigation is bullet-proof.

I view Santa's support in a similar light, but I don't think he's quite as ideologically invested and is more along for the ride.

ZT is similar to Sen, but without the claimed volume of reading behind him.

Hollywood is a rabid batshit ex-Rhodie and WT is a senile old codger hitching his wagon to someone he erroneously perceives as a successful businessman unencumbered by political baggage.

OB is a mindless zealot who fervently believes in Trump as a political strongman.

Have I missed anyone?

These are obviously my own readings of the posters involved, and I might easily be wrong about them, but I think it's a mistake to simply regard them as Trolls.


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 7:20 am 
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Rinkals wrote:
theaxe wrote:
I’m still of the view that anyone on the bored who is on the Drumpf train is a troll. It’s just a shame that so many Americans who are actively getting f**ked over by him and his administration are so loyal to him. As I’ve said many times before Drumpf is a terrible human being and an even worse president.

It would be nice to think so.

I think someone like Sen is generally supportive of what Trump stands for even if he is aware that he isn't the right poster child for the project. I think that the various efforts to investigate Trump's business dealings and Russian links amuse him because of the way that liberals are invested in a process which is horribly complex because of the implications of the POTUS being a crook. Bear in mind that this is a man whom almost half of American voters voted for and, by extension approve of and pursuing him is questioning the legitimacy of their franchise, so it's for that reason that Mueller has to be thorough and has to be sure that his investigation is bullet-proof.

I view Santa's support in a similar light, but I don't think he's quite as ideologically invested and is more along for the ride.

ZT is similar to Sen, but without the claimed volume of reading behind him.

Hollywood is a rabid batshit ex-Rhodie and WT is a senile old codger hitching his wagon to someone he erroneously perceives as a successful businessman unencumbered by political baggage.

OB is a mindless zealot who fervently believes in Trump as a political strongman.

Have I missed anyone?

These are obviously my own readings of the posters involved, and I might easily be wrong about them, but I think it's a mistake to simply regard them as Trolls.


Putting the matter of accuracy aside that is the best post you've ever made.

The idea that everyone who doesn't oppose Trump is a troll - an view that is actually prevalent here - necessarily implies that it is incomprehensible that non-anti-Trumpers can actually have a different view of things. And that, I'm afraid, says more about the anti-non-anti-Trumpers than the non-anti-Trumpers. And is partly why this thread is so rubbish. There is trolling going on, no doubt, but the arguments aren't reducable to that.


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 9:14 am 
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It's all cool Santa. People get that others can have a different view of things. Like thinking it's ok to lie repeatedly or be sexist and or racist. :thumbup:


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 9:25 am 
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I see Donald had a bit of a fit of the lies on Twitter yesterday

Plus ca change


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 9:43 am 
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Fat Old Git wrote:
It's all cool Santa. People get that others can have a different view of things. Like thinking it's ok to lie repeatedly or be sexist and or racist. :thumbup:


Yes I do think it's OK if people think and say things that I don't particularly like or agree with. It's that whole freedom of thought/freedom of speech thing.


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 9:45 am 
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Kim Jong-un is committed to meeting Donald Trump and complete denuclearisation, South Korean president Moon Jae-in said a day after a surprise meeting with the North Korean leader.


https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/ ... im-jong-un


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 9:52 am 
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Santa wrote:
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Kim Jong-un is committed to meeting Donald Trump and complete denuclearisation, South Korean president Moon Jae-in said a day after a surprise meeting with the North Korean leader.


https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/ ... im-jong-un

Nothing much to say about that except hope that it's true.


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 9:57 am 
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Santa wrote:
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Kim Jong-un is committed to meeting Donald Trump and complete denuclearisation, South Korean president Moon Jae-in said a day after a surprise meeting with the North Korean leader.


https://www.theguardian.com/world/2018/ ... im-jong-un


Pull the other one Kim, its got bells on it.


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 10:07 am 
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Santa wrote:
Fat Old Git wrote:
It's all cool Santa. People get that others can have a different view of things. Like thinking it's ok to lie repeatedly or be sexist and or racist. :thumbup:


Yes I do think it's OK if people think and say things that I don't particularly like or agree with. It's that whole freedom of thought/freedom of speech thing.


Freedom of thought and speech and thought doesn't change the morality of the thoughts and speech in question though.


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 10:10 am 
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Fat Old Git wrote:
Santa wrote:
Fat Old Git wrote:
It's all cool Santa. People get that others can have a different view of things. Like thinking it's ok to lie repeatedly or be sexist and or racist. :thumbup:


Yes I do think it's OK if people think and say things that I don't particularly like or agree with. It's that whole freedom of thought/freedom of speech thing.


Freedom of thought and speech and thought doesn't change the morality of the thoughts and speech in question though.


No. Why would it? :?


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 1:48 pm 
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https://usa.spectator.co.uk/2018/05/for ... collusion/

Quote:
For your eyes only: A short history of Democrat-spy collusion

How highly placed members of one administration mobilised the intelligence services to undermine their successors.
Roger Kimball

Who what where when why? The desiderata school teachers drill into their charges trying to master effective writing skills apply also in the effort to understand that byzantine drama known to the world as the Trump-Russia-collusion investigation.

Let’s start with “when.” When did it start? We know that the FBI opened its official investigation on 31 July 2016. An obscure, low-level volunteer to the Trump campaign called Carter Page was front and centre then. He’d been the FBI’s radar for a long time. Years before, it was known, the Russians had made some overtures to him but 1) they concluded that he was an “idiot” not worth recruiting and 2) he had actually aided the FBI in prosecuting at least two Russian spies.

But we now know that the Trump-Russia investigation began before Carter Page. In December 2017, The New York Times excitedly reported in an article called “How the Russia Inquiry Began” that, contrary to their reporting during the previous year, it wasn’t Carter Page who precipitated the inquiry. It was someone called George Papadopoulous, an even more obscure and lower-level factotum than Carter Page. Back in May 2016, the twenty-something Papadopoulous had gotten outside a number of drinks with one Alexander Downer, an Australian diplomat in London and had let slip that “the Russians” had compromising information about Hillary Clinton. When Wikileaks began releasing emails hacked from the Democratic National Committee in June and July, news of the conversation between Downer and Papadopoulos was communicated to the FBI. Thus, according to the Times, the investigation was born.

There were, however, a couple of tiny details that the Times omitted. One was that Downer, an avid Clinton supporter, had arranged for a $25 million donation from the Australian government to the Clinton Foundation. Twenty-five million of the crispest, Kemo Sabe. They also neglected say exactly how Papadopoulos met Alexander Downer.

As it turns out, George Papadopoulos made several new friends in London. There was Joseph Mifsud, a Maltese professor living in London who has ties to British intelligence. It was Mifsud—who has since disappeared—who told Papadopoulos in March 2016 that the Kremlin had “dirt” on Hillary Clinton.

Then there is Stefan Halper, an American-born Cambridge prof and Hillary supporter. Out of the blue, Halper reached out to Papadopoulos in September 2016. He invited him to meet in London and then offered Papadopoulos $3,000 to write a paper on an unrelated topic. He also pumped him about “Russian hacking.” “George, you know about hacking the emails from Russia, right?” Halper is said to have asked him. He also made sure Papadopoulos met for drinks with his assistant, a woman called Azra Turk, who flirted with him over the Chardonnay while pumping him about Russia.

Halper also contacted Carter Page and Sam Clovis, Trump’s campaign co-chair. Is Stefan Halper, the “spy” on the Trump campaign, at the origin of the Trump-Russia meme?

Not really. The real fons et origo is John Brennan, Director of the CIA under Obama. As Trump’s victories in the primaries piled up, Brennan convened a “working group” at CIA headquarters that included Peter Strzok, the disgraced FBI agent, and James Clapper, then Director of National Intelligence, in order to stymie Trump’s campaign.

So much of this story still dwells in the tenebrous realm of redaction. But little by little the truth is emerging, a mosaic whose story is gradually taking shape as one piece after the next completes now this face, now another.

There are details yet to come, but here is the bottom line, the irreducible minimum. A cabal of CIA and FBI operatives, including the Director of the CIA, John Brennan, along with other members of the intelligence “community,” prominently including James Clapper, Director of National Intelligence, and various members of the Obama administration, colluded to undermine Donald Trump’s campaign.

Like almost everyone else, they assumed that Hillary Clinton was a shoo-in, so they were careless about covering their tracks. If Hillary had won, the department of Justice would have been her Department of Justice, John Brennan would still be head of the CIA, and the public would never have known about the spies, the set-ups, the skulduggery.

But Hillary did not win. For the last 16 months, we’ve watched as that exiled cabal shifted its efforts from stopping Trump from winning to a desperate effort to destroy his Presidency. Thanks to the patient work of Devin Nunes, Chairman of the House Intelligence Committee, and a handful of GOP Senators, that effort is now disintegrating. What is being exposed is the biggest political scandal in the history of the United States: the effort by highly placed—exactly how highly placed we still do not know—members of one administration to mobilise the intelligence services and police power of the state to spy upon and destroy first the candidacy and then, when that didn’t work, the administration of a political rival.

It is banana republic behaviour, but it looks now as if those responsible for this effort to undermine American democracy and repeal the results of a free, open, and democratic election will be exposed. Let’s hope that they are also held to account.


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 1:58 pm 
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Oh dear.


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 2:22 pm 
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I feel old. I can remember when the Spectator was worth reading.


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 2:22 pm 
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Quote:
Like almost everyone else, they assumed that Hillary Clinton was a shoo-in, so they were careless about covering their tracks.

Plausible, but if they thought Clinton was a shoo-in why would they risk that much to spy on Trump?


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 5:27 pm 
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As Trump’s victories in the primaries piled up, Brennan convened a “working group” at CIA headquarters that included Peter Strzok, the disgraced FBI agent, and James Clapper, then Director of National Intelligence, in order to stymie Trump’s campaign....

... A cabal of CIA and FBI operatives, including the Director of the CIA, John Brennan, along with other members of the intelligence “community,” prominently including James Clapper, Director of National Intelligence, and various members of the Obama administration, colluded to undermine Donald Trump’s campaign.


And this 'undermining of Trump's campaign' consisted of... er... saying and doing absolutely nothing during his campaign, whilst going public with a story about an investigation into Clinton which ultimately may have gifted Trump victory....

I guess that was part of their plan all along - to undermine Trump and the Republicans by ensuring that he became president. Once he was handed the reigns of power and his supporters realized his campaign was based entirely on lies and fantasy, he and the republicans would be undermined for generations. Those dastardly Dems in the FBI must have been playing the long game.


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 6:37 pm 
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Santa wrote:
Fat Old Git wrote:
Santa wrote:
Fat Old Git wrote:
It's all cool Santa. People get that others can have a different view of things. Like thinking it's ok to lie repeatedly or be sexist and or racist. :thumbup:


Yes I do think it's OK if people think and say things that I don't particularly like or agree with. It's that whole freedom of thought/freedom of speech thing.


Freedom of thought and speech and thought doesn't change the morality of the thoughts and speech in question though.


No. Why would it? :?


Why would you think I could give you a reason to contradict the statement I made?


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 6:38 pm 
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4071 wrote:
Quote:
As Trump’s victories in the primaries piled up, Brennan convened a “working group” at CIA headquarters that included Peter Strzok, the disgraced FBI agent, and James Clapper, then Director of National Intelligence, in order to stymie Trump’s campaign....

... A cabal of CIA and FBI operatives, including the Director of the CIA, John Brennan, along with other members of the intelligence “community,” prominently including James Clapper, Director of National Intelligence, and various members of the Obama administration, colluded to undermine Donald Trump’s campaign.


And this 'undermining of Trump's campaign' consisted of... er... saying and doing absolutely nothing during his campaign, whilst going public with a story about an investigation into Clinton which ultimately may have gifted Trump victory....

I guess that was part of their plan all along - to undermine Trump and the Republicans by ensuring that he became president. Once he was handed the reigns of power and his supporters realized his campaign was based entirely on lies and fantasy, he and the republicans would be undermined for generations. Those dastardly Dems in the FBI must have been playing the long game.


How did they ensure that Trump became president again?


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 6:42 pm 
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Santa wrote:
4071 wrote:
Quote:
As Trump’s victories in the primaries piled up, Brennan convened a “working group” at CIA headquarters that included Peter Strzok, the disgraced FBI agent, and James Clapper, then Director of National Intelligence, in order to stymie Trump’s campaign....

... A cabal of CIA and FBI operatives, including the Director of the CIA, John Brennan, along with other members of the intelligence “community,” prominently including James Clapper, Director of National Intelligence, and various members of the Obama administration, colluded to undermine Donald Trump’s campaign.


And this 'undermining of Trump's campaign' consisted of... er... saying and doing absolutely nothing during his campaign, whilst going public with a story about an investigation into Clinton which ultimately may have gifted Trump victory....

I guess that was part of their plan all along - to undermine Trump and the Republicans by ensuring that he became president. Once he was handed the reigns of power and his supporters realized his campaign was based entirely on lies and fantasy, he and the republicans would be undermined for generations. Those dastardly Dems in the FBI must have been playing the long game.


How did they ensure that Trump became president again?


That was the clueless DNC, their MSM lackeys, and the pied piper strategy. They tried to turn on Trump later but it was too late, the beast had become too great. Van Jones did some good commentary on this as it was unfolding, circa May 2016.


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 8:35 pm 
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Seneca of the Night wrote:
4071 wrote:
Quote:
As Trump’s victories in the primaries piled up, Brennan convened a “working group” at CIA headquarters that included Peter Strzok, the disgraced FBI agent, and James Clapper, then Director of National Intelligence, in order to stymie Trump’s campaign....

... A cabal of CIA and FBI operatives, including the Director of the CIA, John Brennan, along with other members of the intelligence “community,” prominently including James Clapper, Director of National Intelligence, and various members of the Obama administration, colluded to undermine Donald Trump’s campaign.


And this 'undermining of Trump's campaign' consisted of... er... saying and doing absolutely nothing during his campaign, whilst going public with a story about an investigation into Clinton which ultimately may have gifted Trump victory....

I guess that was part of their plan all along - to undermine Trump and the Republicans by ensuring that he became president. Once he was handed the reigns of power and his supporters realized his campaign was based entirely on lies and fantasy, he and the republicans would be undermined for generations. Those dastardly Dems in the FBI must have been playing the long game.


That's some pretty desperate stuff you are now smoking. The answer to the question why would the corrupt agents of deep stateville do anything at all is because that's what they do.

One thing to consider, as the moral arc of the universe bends ever towards justice and the real bad hombres are looking at a stretch in the pokey is to consider who is sheriff, and it you don't shoot the sheriff, then eventually he and his deputies ride out of town looking for you, with the badges of the law on their chests.

Some people might be going down for some crimes they didn't commit for sure, because out in the desert the sheriff makes his own law.


Yeah, yeah - don't think you're fooling anyone.

You believed in Trump, and he's let you down by being exactly as appalling a human being as everyone told you he would be. But in order to avoid admitting that you were wrong about him, you've tried to create an ironic distance by turning into this ad absurdum caricature, allowing you to double down via the medium of parody.

It easier to just admit that Trump is not the man you were looking for.


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 8:46 pm 
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Santa wrote:
4071 wrote:
Quote:
As Trump’s victories in the primaries piled up, Brennan convened a “working group” at CIA headquarters that included Peter Strzok, the disgraced FBI agent, and James Clapper, then Director of National Intelligence, in order to stymie Trump’s campaign....

... A cabal of CIA and FBI operatives, including the Director of the CIA, John Brennan, along with other members of the intelligence “community,” prominently including James Clapper, Director of National Intelligence, and various members of the Obama administration, colluded to undermine Donald Trump’s campaign.


And this 'undermining of Trump's campaign' consisted of... er... saying and doing absolutely nothing during his campaign, whilst going public with a story about an investigation into Clinton which ultimately may have gifted Trump victory....

I guess that was part of their plan all along - to undermine Trump and the Republicans by ensuring that he became president. Once he was handed the reigns of power and his supporters realized his campaign was based entirely on lies and fantasy, he and the republicans would be undermined for generations. Those dastardly Dems in the FBI must have been playing the long game.


How did they ensure that Trump became president again?


As a general rule, when using obvious sarcasm I eschew emoticons as an insult to the reader's intelligence.

Evidently I occasionally overestimate the reader.

For you, I'll try and use emoticons as an aid to understanding.


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 8:50 pm 
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I am enjoying watching the Democrats becoming the defenders of the establishment (the FBI, the prosecutors and law enforcement in general etc etc ) while the Republicans rail against the overreach the FBI, the prosecutors and law enforcement in general.

And all down to one man


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 9:54 pm 
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_fatprop wrote:
I am enjoying watching the Democrats becoming the defenders of the establishment (the FBI, the prosecutors and law enforcement in general etc etc ) while the Republicans rail against the overreach the FBI, the prosecutors and law enforcement in general.

And all down to one man


I'd add a second man to that. Admiral Michael S Rogers.


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 10:02 pm 
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4071 wrote:
Santa wrote:
4071 wrote:
Quote:
As Trump’s victories in the primaries piled up, Brennan convened a “working group” at CIA headquarters that included Peter Strzok, the disgraced FBI agent, and James Clapper, then Director of National Intelligence, in order to stymie Trump’s campaign....

... A cabal of CIA and FBI operatives, including the Director of the CIA, John Brennan, along with other members of the intelligence “community,” prominently including James Clapper, Director of National Intelligence, and various members of the Obama administration, colluded to undermine Donald Trump’s campaign.


And this 'undermining of Trump's campaign' consisted of... er... saying and doing absolutely nothing during his campaign, whilst going public with a story about an investigation into Clinton which ultimately may have gifted Trump victory....

I guess that was part of their plan all along - to undermine Trump and the Republicans by ensuring that he became president. Once he was handed the reigns of power and his supporters realized his campaign was based entirely on lies and fantasy, he and the republicans would be undermined for generations. Those dastardly Dems in the FBI must have been playing the long game.


How did they ensure that Trump became president again?


As a general rule, when using obvious sarcasm I eschew emoticons as an insult to the reader's intelligence.

Evidently I occasionally overestimate the reader.

For you, I'll try and use emoticons as an aid to understanding.


No need for that. just learn what sarcasm is and how to do it and you'll be right. :thumbup:


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PostPosted: Sun May 27, 2018 11:29 pm 
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Roger Kimball hasn’t been the same since he tracked down the one-armed man who killed his wife while being chased by Tommy Lee Jones.


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 1:14 am 
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Seneca of the Night wrote:
Image

:( :( :( It's sad.


WTF is he on about?

WTF is he on?


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 2:06 am 
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4071 wrote:
Quote:
As Trump’s victories in the primaries piled up, Brennan convened a “working group” at CIA headquarters that included Peter Strzok, the disgraced FBI agent, and James Clapper, then Director of National Intelligence, in order to stymie Trump’s campaign....

... A cabal of CIA and FBI operatives, including the Director of the CIA, John Brennan, along with other members of the intelligence “community,” prominently including James Clapper, Director of National Intelligence, and various members of the Obama administration, colluded to undermine Donald Trump’s campaign.


And this 'undermining of Trump's campaign' consisted of... er... saying and doing absolutely nothing during his campaign, whilst going public with a story about an investigation into Clinton which ultimately may have gifted Trump victory....

I guess that was part of their plan all along - to undermine Trump and the Republicans by ensuring that he became president. Once he was handed the reigns of power and his supporters realized his campaign was based entirely on lies and fantasy, he and the republicans would be undermined for generations. Those dastardly Dems in the FBI must have been playing the long game.


Yeah, you would think if they had found anything it would have been released (sorry leaked by a whistle blower) during the election

But I do wonder if the FBI under Bush had informants placed in the Obama campaign team (for whatever reason) whether it would have been looked on as favourably


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 2:18 am 
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_fatprop wrote:
4071 wrote:
Quote:
As Trump’s victories in the primaries piled up, Brennan convened a “working group” at CIA headquarters that included Peter Strzok, the disgraced FBI agent, and James Clapper, then Director of National Intelligence, in order to stymie Trump’s campaign....

... A cabal of CIA and FBI operatives, including the Director of the CIA, John Brennan, along with other members of the intelligence “community,” prominently including James Clapper, Director of National Intelligence, and various members of the Obama administration, colluded to undermine Donald Trump’s campaign.


And this 'undermining of Trump's campaign' consisted of... er... saying and doing absolutely nothing during his campaign, whilst going public with a story about an investigation into Clinton which ultimately may have gifted Trump victory....

I guess that was part of their plan all along - to undermine Trump and the Republicans by ensuring that he became president. Once he was handed the reigns of power and his supporters realized his campaign was based entirely on lies and fantasy, he and the republicans would be undermined for generations. Those dastardly Dems in the FBI must have been playing the long game.


Yeah, you would think if they had found anything it would have been released (sorry leaked by a whistle blower) during the election

But I do wonder if the FBI under Bush had informants placed in the Obama campaign team (for whatever reason) whether it would have been looked on as favourably


Nunes would have been unbearable (more than usual) had there been any genuine dirt.


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 2:35 am 
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Kiwias wrote:
_fatprop wrote:
4071 wrote:
Quote:
As Trump’s victories in the primaries piled up, Brennan convened a “working group” at CIA headquarters that included Peter Strzok, the disgraced FBI agent, and James Clapper, then Director of National Intelligence, in order to stymie Trump’s campaign....

... A cabal of CIA and FBI operatives, including the Director of the CIA, John Brennan, along with other members of the intelligence “community,” prominently including James Clapper, Director of National Intelligence, and various members of the Obama administration, colluded to undermine Donald Trump’s campaign.


And this 'undermining of Trump's campaign' consisted of... er... saying and doing absolutely nothing during his campaign, whilst going public with a story about an investigation into Clinton which ultimately may have gifted Trump victory....

I guess that was part of their plan all along - to undermine Trump and the Republicans by ensuring that he became president. Once he was handed the reigns of power and his supporters realized his campaign was based entirely on lies and fantasy, he and the republicans would be undermined for generations. Those dastardly Dems in the FBI must have been playing the long game.


Yeah, you would think if they had found anything it would have been released (sorry leaked by a whistle blower) during the election

But I do wonder if the FBI under Bush had informants placed in the Obama campaign team (for whatever reason) whether it would have been looked on as favourably


Nunes would have been unbearable (more than usual) had there been any genuine dirt.


And this is where it gets murky, you have embedded informants/whistle-blowers/spies within the campaign and find nothing even worth leaking, but we still end with a special investigator into "collusion"


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 3:12 am 
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_fatprop wrote:
Kiwias wrote:
_fatprop wrote:
4071 wrote:
Quote:
As Trump’s victories in the primaries piled up, Brennan convened a “working group” at CIA headquarters that included Peter Strzok, the disgraced FBI agent, and James Clapper, then Director of National Intelligence, in order to stymie Trump’s campaign....

... A cabal of CIA and FBI operatives, including the Director of the CIA, John Brennan, along with other members of the intelligence “community,” prominently including James Clapper, Director of National Intelligence, and various members of the Obama administration, colluded to undermine Donald Trump’s campaign.


And this 'undermining of Trump's campaign' consisted of... er... saying and doing absolutely nothing during his campaign, whilst going public with a story about an investigation into Clinton which ultimately may have gifted Trump victory....

I guess that was part of their plan all along - to undermine Trump and the Republicans by ensuring that he became president. Once he was handed the reigns of power and his supporters realized his campaign was based entirely on lies and fantasy, he and the republicans would be undermined for generations. Those dastardly Dems in the FBI must have been playing the long game.


Yeah, you would think if they had found anything it would have been released (sorry leaked by a whistle blower) during the election

But I do wonder if the FBI under Bush had informants placed in the Obama campaign team (for whatever reason) whether it would have been looked on as favourably


Nunes would have been unbearable (more than usual) had there been any genuine dirt.


And this is where it gets murky, you have embedded informants/whistle-blowers/spies within the campaign and find nothing even worth leaking, but we still end with a special investigator into "collusion"


He is hardly going to rush out and blurt out intel that is damning for the campaign, now, is he? You know, the multiple contacts between campaign staff and Russia that they lied about and a lot more that Mueller has most likely got.


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 4:38 am 
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Probably been said, but I think they haven't got much re collusion etc.etc.
They're playing a different game - threats with whatever crime they can come up with against certain individuals (which are not too difficult) and catching them out while lying under oath. Rinse, repeat.


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 6:14 am 
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Are we back at the notion that 'collusion' is a crime?

I thought we've been over this as nauseam.


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 6:17 am 
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Rinkals wrote:
Are we back at the notion that 'collusion' is a crime?

I thought we've been over this as nauseam.


'Collusion' is not even mentioned in the appointment of the special counsel.


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 7:15 am 
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We've come a looooooong way in 600 pages

Kiwias wrote:
Floppykid wrote:
bubblefart having the Russians in the oval office today was surreal, and even not having the white house press core there at all either.


The Foreign Minister makes a bit of sense but the Ambassador who is at the heart of the investigation into contact and collusion between the Trump campaign and Russia?

It is Trump doing this

Spoiler: show
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Kiwias wrote:
munch wrote:
Kiwias wrote:
munch wrote:
I think we're fairly close on this. I guess it's down to what is the most productive outcome. From my side I think acting on conspiracy theory in open public discussion is wrong. I know you get what I'm saying. What's your thoughts on that?


What do you mean "acting on conspiracy theory in open public discussion"?


That T.rump and Sessions were culpable in conspiring with Russia in a voting scam. That was the outright media speculation leading up to these hearings.

Put me right here, Kiwias, because I've had so many responses I'm not sure of your position. Do you think T.rump, et al. were complicit in Russian interference with the election process? I just don't want us to be arguing at cross purposes,


The media claimed that people in the trump campaign were in contact with members of the Russian government, most of which has been proven true, so it was not speculation.

I have no idea whether they actively concluded with the Russians and expect the hearings and in particular the Mueller investigation to determine the truth of this.

I also believe that the repeated lies by members of teh trump campaign and staff about contacts with the Russians suggests they knew what they were doing, whether it be collusion or not, was highly inappropriate, if not illegal.

trump's firing of Comey and the lies surrounding that raise deep concerns.


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 8:20 am 
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obelixtim wrote:
Seneca of the Night wrote:
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:( :( :( It's sad.


WTF is he on about?

WTF is he on?


Whatever it is, he is still on it.

SIZE
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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 8:44 am 
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Kiwias wrote:

Whatever it is, he is still on it.

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Why lie about that - there were 50 reporters in the room that could back up the NYT story.


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 8:57 am 
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Because plan A is to try and discredit the media at every turn. Doesn't matter what the truth is or how easy it is to verify. Just put it out there that at every opportunity.


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 9:01 am 
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Giuliani doing a bang up job. What a bell end.

Also...the uncomfortable moment where he calls Brennan a clown at the end of the interview - while Brennan is standing in the studio waiting to get interviewed next. :blush:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWgJzCJi8vk


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 9:06 am 
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Giuliani doing a bang up job. What a bell end.

Also...the uncomfortable moment where he calls Brennan a clown at the end of the interview - while Brennan is standing in the studio waiting to get interviewed next. :blush:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWgJzCJi8vk


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PostPosted: Mon May 28, 2018 10:14 am 
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Seneca of the Night wrote:
BokJock wrote:
Kiwias wrote:

Whatever it is, he is still on it.

SIZE
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Why lie about that - there were 50 reporters in the room that could back up the NYT story.


Reporters don't have any credibility.


Who needs an independent press anyway?

Well done, Donny.


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