Your Country's Hardest Pack

pieman99 · Post by **pieman99** » Sat Jul 15, 2017 6:25 pm

one for wales

Bobby Windsor
Garin Jenkins
Charlie Faulkner
Brian Thomas
Geoff Wheel
Paul Moriarty
Paul Ringer
Mark Jones

Hawk97 · Post by **Hawk97** » Sat Jul 15, 2017 6:41 pm

Troll wrote:1. Allen Jacobsen
2. Ross Ford
3. Simon Berghan
4. Al Kellock
5. Grant Gilchrist
6. Richie Vernon
7. Blair Cowan
8. Tyrone Holmes

Findlay Calder instead of Al fücking Kellock.

Hawk97 · Post by **Hawk97** » Sat Jul 15, 2017 6:42 pm

Incidentally, that 91 England pack on the day were;

Leonard
Moore
Probyn
Ackford
Dooley
Teague
Winterbottom
Richards

Only France match it.

booze · Post by **booze** » Sat Jul 15, 2017 8:11 pm

CrazyIslander wrote:Wallabies
1. Crowley
2. Lawton
3. Noriega
4. McCall
5. Cutler
6. Kefu
7. Willie O
8. Sam Scott Young

Looks weak

Jeff the Bear · Post by **Jeff the Bear** » Sat Jul 15, 2017 8:16 pm

pieman99 wrote:one for wales

Bobby Windsor
Garin Jenkins
Charlie Faulkner
Brian Thomas
Geoff Wheel
Paul Moriarty
Paul Ringer
Mark Jones

Garin Jenkins...what a hero.

Probably Wales' last proper hard bastard. We don't produce them any more (and tbf, we barely used to produce them before)

Botha Boy · Post by **Botha Boy** » Sat Jul 15, 2017 8:48 pm

Mr. Very Popular wrote:
Jim Lahey wrote:Claw
Best
Hayes
Brennan
POC
Ferris
J O'Connor
Vic Costello
Willie John for Brennan

I struggle with the idea of Hayes as a 'hard' player ... just seen too many replays of him blubbing during the anthems. I would move Claw to tighthead and have possibly Popplewell at loosened (but not really convinced).

Willie John for Brennan who drops to back row replace JOC. Paddy Johns unlucky not to get in, but no-one out-hards POC and Willie John.

And Willie Duggan for the powder puff Victor Costello (seriously ? did you really mean that ... ?). Willie will need 20 Woodbine to be available to play but you can still source them, can't you?

I'm assuming this is 'hardest team' is to go toe-to-toe if there is a donnybrook during the game ... right ? I am not looking for a balanced back row and such. More a pack when any one player would just go sort Richard Loe or Brian Moore out if necessary.

Looking forward to the Argentinian line-up. Interested to see if Mendez gets even close to the final line-up there.

Troll · Post by **Troll** » Sat Jul 15, 2017 9:25 pm

Hawk97 wrote:
Troll wrote:1. Allen Jacobsen
2. Ross Ford
3. Simon Berghan
4. Al Kellock
5. Grant Gilchrist
6. Richie Vernon
7. Blair Cowan
8. Tyrone Holmes
Findlay Calder instead of Al fücking Kellock.

no

Edit: jesus christ spoiler that Jeff

nuffsaid · Post by **nuffsaid** » Sat Jul 15, 2017 9:56 pm

Hawk97 wrote:Incidentally, that 91 England pack on the day were;

Leonard
Moore
Probyn
Ackford
Dooley
Teague
Winterbottom
Richards

Only France match it.

This

Jim Lahey · Post by **Jim Lahey** » Sat Jul 15, 2017 10:01 pm

I may have only caught the tail end of his career but big Vic certainly didn't strike me as powder puff. The man always seemed to make ground every time he carried. Never seen Willie Duggan play so can't comment.

Hayes was one hard kunt. You don't miss as few games as he did during his career in the front row without being as hard as nails. The same rule would apply to Heaslip in fairness but he comes across as a bit of an eejit off the pitch.

earl the beaver · Post by **earl the beaver** » Sat Jul 15, 2017 11:10 pm

No Blair Mayne? He's the Irish captain for this team.

dam0 · Post by **dam0** » Sat Jul 15, 2017 11:31 pm

Kiwias wrote:
les@mooloolaba wrote:
Seneca of the Night wrote:Kevin Skinner
Futzy
Keith Murdoch
Pinetree Meads
Filth Oliver
Cowboy Shaw
Red Conway
Buck Shelford

I might be tempted to take BBB at 5 -- imagine him with Pinetree

BBBT or BBBR? Either would be worthy of selection.

Stevus55 · Post by **Stevus55** » Sat Jul 15, 2017 11:40 pm

There's definitely a distinction between being a thug and being hard as nails. Hayes was definitely no thug, but hard as they come.

kiap · Post by **kiap** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 12:03 am

France was always King for Thugs.

Eye gougers, testes grippers, and stompers galore.

CrazyIslander · Post by **CrazyIslander** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 12:11 am

nuffsaid wrote:
Hawk97 wrote:Incidentally, that 91 England pack on the day were;

Leonard
Moore
Probyn
Ackford
Dooley
Teague
Winterbottom
Richards

Only France match it.
This

Lots of those guys played in the RWC91 final. The Wallabies pack had their measure easy.

Hellraiser · Post by **Hellraiser** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 12:21 am

Stevus55 wrote:There's definitely a distinction between being a thug and being hard as nails. Hayes was definitely no thug, but hard as they come.

“He developed his confidence and his attitude and he became a bully on the field, which was good,” explains Winder, whose nickname around Marist – Marist Old Boys Rugby Football Club Invercargill to give the club its full name - is the Chosen One.

“At the start he wasn’t intimidating at all, even with his big frame, so we taught him how to be a bully, own your position and dominate – the way to get respect.

“He figured out that that was New Zealand rugby, and then the pace of it and the skill level too. Once he had that, he just loved it. It was his passion to go out there and hurt people, and he did.

“Oh he really did! He made the opposition’s lives miserable sometimes. He’d go out and destroy them physically and mentally for 80 minutes.”

jezzer · Post by **jezzer** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 12:41 am

A Scotland one, fairly old school. Was tempted to put Hamilton in at lock but no room with Brown and Hines.

Ian Milne
Ken Milne
Ian MacLaughlin
Nathan Hines
Gordon Brown
John Jeffrey
Finlay Calder
David Leslie

Hellraiser · Post by **Hellraiser** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 1:05 am

jezzer wrote:A Scotland one, fairly old school. Was tempted to put Hamilton in at lock but no room with Brown and Hines.

Ian Milne
Ken Milne
Ian MacLaughlin
Nathan Hines
Gordon Brown
John Jeffrey
Finlay Calder
David Leslie

Hamilton isn't hard, he's just big and has tats. Hines was proper fúcking hard.

Lacrobat · Post by **Lacrobat** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 3:14 am

For NZ:

8 Wayne Shelford
7 Kel Tremain
6 Mark Shaw
5 Colin Meads
4 Brad Thorn
3 Keith Murdoch
2 Sean Fitzpatrick
1 Kevin Skinner

16 Andrew Hore
17 John Ashworth
18 Frank Oliver
19 Grizz Wylie

(Edited to add a subs bench)

Kiwias · Post by **Kiwias** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 3:15 am

dam0 wrote:
Kiwias wrote:
les@mooloolaba wrote:
Seneca of the Night wrote:Kevin Skinner
Futzy
Keith Murdoch
Pinetree Meads
Filth Oliver
Cowboy Shaw
Red Conway
Buck Shelford

I might be tempted to take BBB at 5 -- imagine him with Pinetree
BBBT or BBBR? Either would be worthy of selection.

The original to start, with BBBR on the bench

Hellraiser · Post by **Hellraiser** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 3:20 am

Lacrobat wrote:For NZ:

8 Wayne Shelford
7 Kel Tremain
6 Mark Shaw
5 Frank Oliver
4 Brad Thorn
3 Keith Murdoch
2 Sean Fitzpatrick
1 Kevin Skinner

So Loe was dirty rather than hard?

Kiwias · Post by **Kiwias** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 3:21 am

Lacrobat wrote:For NZ:

8 Wayne Shelford
7 Kel Tremain
6 Mark Shaw
5 Frank Oliver
4 Brad Thorn
3 Keith Murdoch
2 Sean Fitzpatrick
1 Kevin Skinner

Keven Eveleigh at 7 if you want dirty hard

CrazyIslander · Post by **CrazyIslander** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 3:22 am

All Blacks
1. McDowell
2. Futzy
3. Skinner
4. Meads
5. Thorn
6. Collins
7. M. Jones
8. Shelford

Dork Lard · Post by **Dork Lard** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 12:41 pm

Stevus55 wrote:There's definitely a distinction between being a thug and being hard as nails. Hayes was definitely no thug, but hard as they come.

Are you saying..are you saying thugs thugs can't get a proper erection ??

Bogbunny · Post by **Bogbunny** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 12:49 pm

earl the beaver wrote:No Blair Mayne? He's the Irish captain for this team.

Mayne for POC
Goodall at 8 would tighten them up no end.
Syd Millar in the front row too.

None of these modern day softees

fatcat · Post by **fatcat** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 1:37 pm

booze wrote:
CrazyIslander wrote:Wallabies
1. Crowley
2. Lawton
3. Noriega
4. McCall
5. Cutler
6. Kefu
7. Willie O
8. Sam Scott Young
Looks weak

Didn't Kefu suffer a one punch knockout at the hand(s) of Bunce? No great shame, but still - a back.

CrazyIslander · Post by **CrazyIslander** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 1:44 pm

fatcat wrote:
booze wrote:
CrazyIslander wrote:Wallabies
1. Crowley
2. Lawton
3. Noriega
4. McCall
5. Cutler
6. Kefu
7. Willie O
8. Sam Scott Young
Looks weak

Didn't Kefu suffer a one punch knockout at the hand(s) of Bunce? No great shame, but still - a back.

I don't remember that ever happening.

CrazyIslander · Post by **CrazyIslander** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 1:49 pm

booze wrote:
CrazyIslander wrote:Wallabies
1. Crowley
2. Lawton
3. Noriega
4. McCall
5. Cutler
6. Kefu
7. Willie O
8. Sam Scott Young
Looks weak

Wallabies pack consists of players from the 80s/90s when we pretty much dominated everyone.

Hawk97 · Post by **Hawk97** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 1:59 pm

CrazyIslander wrote:
nuffsaid wrote:
Hawk97 wrote:Incidentally, that 91 England pack on the day were;

Leonard
Moore
Probyn
Ackford
Dooley
Teague
Winterbottom
Richards

Only France match it.
This
Lots of those guys played in the RWC91 final. The Wallabies pack had their measure easy.

I thought we were discussing hardness, not ability?

CrazyIslander · Post by **CrazyIslander** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 2:09 pm

Hawk97 wrote:
CrazyIslander wrote:
nuffsaid wrote:
Hawk97 wrote:Incidentally, that 91 England pack on the day were;

Leonard
Moore
Probyn
Ackford
Dooley
Teague
Winterbottom
Richards

Only France match it.
This
Lots of those guys played in the RWC91 final. The Wallabies pack had their measure easy.
I thought we were discussing hardness, not ability?

I think we can agree both packs were of equal hardness.

Smee · Post by **Smee** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 2:19 pm

jezzer wrote:A Scotland one, fairly old school. Was tempted to put Hamilton in at lock but no room with Brown and Hines.

Ian Milne
Ken Milne
Ian MacLaughlin
Nathan Hines
Gordon Brown
John Jeffrey
Finlay Calder
David Leslie

Jason White worth a shout, he was, I believe a nightclub bouncer in Glasgow at the outset of his career.

CrazyIslander · Post by **CrazyIslander** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 2:26 pm

The Canadian pack of early 90s would kick the shit out of these put together packs.

Smee · Post by **Smee** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 2:31 pm

CrazyIslander wrote:The Canadian pack of early 90s would kick the shit out of these put together packs.

Great call.......remember the story about that second row (name escapes me) putting some reprobate on the London underground in their place in 91 or thereabouts.......

Bobcock · Post by **Bobcock** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 2:36 pm

The late Norm Hadley

CrazyIslander · Post by **CrazyIslander** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 2:39 pm

Bobcock wrote:The late Norm Hadley

He's dead? Tragic news.

Bobcock · Post by **Bobcock** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 2:51 pm

Last Year

Smee · Post by **Smee** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 3:02 pm

Bobcock wrote:The late Norm Hadley

Thats him.

Sobering thread really, the genuine hard nuts from yesteryear have gone......the toughest players from today are namby pamby prima donnas by comparison. They are better athletes but they are not nearly as hard.

OttawaKat · Post by **OttawaKat** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 4:23 pm

CrazyIslander wrote:The Canadian pack of early 90s would kick the shit out of these put together packs.

Who would be in it?

Charron, Hadley, Ennis, McKinnon come to mind. Not sure in the front row.

CrazyIslander · Post by **CrazyIslander** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 4:24 pm

OttawaKat wrote:
CrazyIslander wrote:The Canadian pack of early 90s would kick the shit out of these put together packs.
Who would be in it?

Charron, Hadley, Ennis, McKinnon come to mind. Not sure in the front row.

Rod Snow for prop.

Hawk97 · Post by **Hawk97** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 10:12 pm

CrazyIslander wrote:
Hawk97 wrote:
CrazyIslander wrote:
nuffsaid wrote:
Hawk97 wrote:Incidentally, that 91 England pack on the day were;

Leonard
Moore
Probyn
Ackford
Dooley
Teague
Winterbottom
Richards

Only France match it.
This
Lots of those guys played in the RWC91 final. The Wallabies pack had their measure easy.
I thought we were discussing hardness, not ability?
I think we can agree both packs were of equal hardness.

Lenny · Post by **Lenny** » Sun Jul 16, 2017 10:16 pm

Bogbunny wrote:
earl the beaver wrote:No Blair Mayne? He's the Irish captain for this team.
Mayne for POC
Goodall at 8 would tighten them up no end.
Syd Millar in the front row too.

None of these modern day softees

Phil O'Callaghan at tighthead was a scary combination of being genuinely hard all of the time, and genuinely unhinged on occasions. I played with him towards the end of his career, when he wouldn't prop at lower levels because he had enough self awareness to know that if some gobshite decided to make a name for himself that he (Phil) would quite possibly hospitalise the guy. So he played second row, from where he dispensed his own brutal brand of justice to those who offended his somewhat strange sense of right and wrong. When I played with him he was around 40 and he was built like a block shithouse, and was still fitter than most of our first team. A real character, but fcuk he was scary sometimes, even playing in the same team with him.