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PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:08 pm 
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Just that really? How do you think it would have finished if there was no conference and each team played the other once?

My guess is that the Australian teams would have performed worse, the New Zealand teams better and the South African, Argentine and Japanese teams about the same.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:17 pm 
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The Australians get essentially at least one and sometimes two free bye weeks against the Sunwolves each season as they are almost guaranteed points there.

The SA and NZ teams tend to cannibalise points from each other in most seasons. For example this year the Chiefs beat the Crusaders who beat the Hurricanes who beat the Highlanders who beat the Blues who beat the ... Chiefs.

The SA sides this year (though it's not the case normally) were compromised by having to play against the Jags twice as they have been so strong.

I'd guess final season positions would even up not too differently to how they are now, though. The Saders, Jags, Brumbies and Hurricanes were clearly the top sides in the comp this year regardless of the opposition and the rest of the teams who made the playoffs are just making up the numbers really.


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2019 9:46 pm 
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naki wrote:
The Australians get essentially at least one and sometimes two free bye weeks against the Sunwolves each season as they are almost guaranteed points there.

The SA and NZ teams tend to cannibalise points from each other in most seasons. For example this year the Chiefs beat the Crusaders who beat the Hurricanes who beat the Highlanders who beat the Blues who beat the ... Chiefs.

The SA sides this year (though it's not the case normally) were compromised by having to play against the Jags twice as they have been so strong.

I'd guess final season positions would even up not too differently to how they are now, though. The Saders, Jags, Brumbies and Hurricanes were clearly the top sides in the comp this year regardless of the opposition and the rest of the teams who made the playoffs are just making up the numbers really.


I agree (mostly), I would guess that the Hurricanes would be number 2 team but I think the Brumbies would have been mid table (maybe upper-mid table)


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2019 10:41 pm 
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Pickandgo shows the table from highest points to lowest.

Image

http://www.lassen.co.nz/s14tab.php


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PostPosted: Sat Jun 15, 2019 11:23 pm 
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mr bungle wrote:
Pickandgo shows the table from highest points to lowest.

Image

http://www.lassen.co.nz/s14tab.php


I know, but the Australian teams play each other (and the sunwolves) home and away, the New Zealand teams play each other home and away.

Therefore the Australian teams have an easier schedule and the New Zealand teams have a harder schedule.

I was asking what do you guys think the table would be if each team played every other team just once (like the good old days)


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 12:03 am 
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Wait another 6-7 months and find out.

10,000 km round-robin. Enjoy while it lasts.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 12:13 am 
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kiap wrote:
Wait another 6-7 months and find out.

10,000 km round-robin. Enjoy while it lasts.


You really are the harbinger of doom when it comes to Super Rugby, aren't you? Gleefully hoping it fails, as you desperately try and hype up Twiggy Forrest's nothing-league across multiple threads. How many were at Ballymore on Friday night for the non-Samoan Samoan team vs the Force?


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 12:21 am 
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Ali's Choice wrote:
You really are the harbinger of doom when it comes to Super Rugby, aren't you?

I am, mate

Ali's Choice wrote:
How many were at Ballymore on Friday night for the non-Samoan Samoan team vs the Force?


1500 to 2k


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 1:14 am 
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kiap wrote:
Ali's Choice wrote:
You really are the harbinger of doom when it comes to Super Rugby, aren't you?

I am, mate

Ali's Choice wrote:
How many were at Ballymore on Friday night for the non-Samoan Samoan team vs the Force?


1500 to 2k


:lol: :thumbup:


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 1:20 am 
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kiap wrote:
Ali's Choice wrote:
You really are the harbinger of doom when it comes to Super Rugby, aren't you?

I am, mate

Ali's Choice wrote:
How many were at Ballymore on Friday night for the non-Samoan Samoan team vs the Force?


1500 to 2k


That's a good turnout considering neither team was at home.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 1:29 am 
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Was a good game to watch, too.

Back to the Soup and the round-robin, though.

My prediction is more teams to be cut - unless Sanzaar respectively secure themselves WR windfalls.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 1:50 am 
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kiap wrote:
Was a good game to watch, too.

Back to the Soup and the round-robin, though.

My prediction is more teams to be cut - unless Sanzaar respectively secure themselves WR windfalls.

Hoiles was calling for another Oz side to go on Friday after watching the Tahs and Rebels flail. Im sure he didn't mean the Tahs though :roll: despite their position on the table.

Was a good game yesterday but I still think a new national comp on FTA has to be thE baseline for any future of the game in this country despite GRR


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 2:01 am 
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I'm not a fan of Hoilesey's punditry (nor Drew Mitchell's, although I liked him as a player) but I can see it playing out like he says, sadly.

Yes, some component of FTA is needed to escape the 25-year invisibilty cloak.

For such a baseline comp, though, whatever its name and scope, a few apron strings will need to be cut.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 2:06 am 
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kiap wrote:
I'm not a fan of Hoilesey's punditry (nor Drew Mitchell's, although I liked him as a player) but I can see it playing out like he says, sadly.

Yes, some component of FTA is needed to escape the 25-year invisibilty cloak.

For such a baseline comp, though, whatever its name and scope, a few apron strings will need to be cut.

And its hard to see RA doing that too, nor have the smarts to re structure domestic rugby. It really needs a third party engaged to specifically to set up recommendations for the game. however we know RA have ignored such reports and recommendations in the past.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 2:19 am 
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I see canes actually won more games than anyone else yet still 4th :? :thumbdown:


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 5:54 am 
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kiap wrote:
Wait another 6-7 months and find out.

10,000 km round-robin. Enjoy while it lasts.

Only from 2021


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 6:51 am 
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to a degree, most would agree that the conference system actually makes the NZ teams stronger thus making the All Blacks stronger..


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 7:34 am 
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mdaclarke wrote:

I was asking what do you guys think the table would be if each team played every other team just once (like the good old days)


Read the OP properly now :thumbup:


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 8:00 am 
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What would my schlong look like if it was a growler?
or
What would my car look like if it was a boat?

This is a NZ thing right?


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 8:06 am 
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Brumbies to beat the Hurricanes by a point in a home final for the Brumbies. Here first.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 8:17 am 
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comets wrote:
to a degree, most would agree that the conference system actually makes the NZ teams stronger thus making the All Blacks stronger..


Yep


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 8:26 am 
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Olo wrote:
What would my schlong look like if it was a growler?
or
What would my car look like if it was a boat?

This is a NZ thing right?


mdaclarke is not a kiwi


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 8:28 am 
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Olo wrote:
What would my schlong look like if it was a growler?
or
What would my car look like if it was a boat?

This is a NZ thing right?


If my grandma had wheels she'd be a bike.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 9:06 am 
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naki wrote:
Olo wrote:
What would my schlong look like if it was a growler?
or
What would my car look like if it was a boat?

This is a NZ thing right?


mdaclarke is not a kiwi


Ok. My bad.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 10:20 am 
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Olo wrote:
naki wrote:
Olo wrote:
What would my schlong look like if it was a growler?
or
What would my car look like if it was a boat?

This is a NZ thing right?


mdaclarke is not a kiwi


Ok. My bad.


I'm Welsh! (not sure if that is better or worse than being a Kiwi)


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 10:22 am 
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mdaclarke wrote:
Olo wrote:
naki wrote:
Olo wrote:
What would my schlong look like if it was a growler?
or
What would my car look like if it was a boat?

This is a NZ thing right?


mdaclarke is not a kiwi


Ok. My bad.


I'm Welsh! (not sure if that is better or worse than being a Kiwi)



Worse.







Yep


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 10:27 am 
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kiap wrote:
I'm not a fan of Hoilesey's punditry (nor Drew Mitchell's, although I liked him as a player) but I can see it playing out like he says, sadly.

Yes, some component of FTA is needed to escape the 25-year invisibilty cloak.

For such a baseline comp, though, whatever its name and scope, a few apron strings will need to be cut.


I was surprised by Hoiles' candour re: depth or the lack thereof...


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 10:39 am 
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Taranaki Snapper wrote:
kiap wrote:
I'm not a fan of Hoilesey's punditry (nor Drew Mitchell's, although I liked him as a player) but I can see it playing out like he says, sadly.

Yes, some component of FTA is needed to escape the 25-year invisibilty cloak.

For such a baseline comp, though, whatever its name and scope, a few apron strings will need to be cut.


I was surprised by Hoiles' candour re: depth or the lack thereof...


I'm not on board with most of what he said. The thing to really note is his proposed course of action, which could happen.

It's worth a laugh, even while the outcome is in many ways grim!


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 10:45 am 
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Hoiles is a Mungo at heart. He's an idiot for suggesting we should be cutting another super rugby teams. Anyone with a few brain cells would know that cutting the number of professional teams is not the answer. How the f are we supposed to keep our players with just 3 teams? That's a f dubming suggesting for a bogan mungo wannabe. We should have kept 5 teams. The problem with all our super rugby teams is poor coaching. We have enough talent but they are very poorly coached.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 10:49 am 
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TranceNRG wrote:
Hoiles is a Mungo at heart. He's an idiot for suggesting we should be cutting another super rugby teams. Anyone with a few brain cells would know that cutting the number of professional teams is not the answer. How the f are we supposed to keep our players with just 3 teams? That's a f dubming suggesting for a bogan mungo wannabe. We should have kept 5 teams. The problem with all our super rugby teams is poor coaching. We have enough talent but they are very poorly coached.



Mungo?
The Super 12 comp was far superior to every other expanded reincarnation that has followed. The sooner we get back to that, the better.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:04 am 
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rett wrote:
The Super 12 comp was far superior to every other expanded reincarnation that has followed. The sooner we get back to that, the better.

It's like pining for the era of Nokia phones and Kodak film.

Even if you replicated the exact format of 1996, you won't reincarnate the comp.

The world has irrevocably moved on.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:06 am 
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kiap wrote:
rett wrote:
The Super 12 comp was far superior to every other expanded reincarnation that has followed. The sooner we get back to that, the better.

It's like pining for the era of Nokia phones and Kodak film.

Even if you replicated the exact format of 1996, you won't reincarnate the comp.

The world has irrevocably moved on.


This. People who advocate 3 teams must seriously hate Australian rugby. It's seriously bye bye Australian rugby if we only have 3 professional rugby teams. Heck even 4 teams is too low for us to have a fighting chance against Mungoball, AFL and football.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:37 am 
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TranceNRG wrote:
kiap wrote:
rett wrote:
The Super 12 comp was far superior to every other expanded reincarnation that has followed. The sooner we get back to that, the better.

It's like pining for the era of Nokia phones and Kodak film.

Even if you replicated the exact format of 1996, you won't reincarnate the comp.

The world has irrevocably moved on.


This. People who advocate 3 teams must seriously hate Australian rugby. It's seriously bye bye Australian rugby if we only have 3 professional rugby teams. Heck even 4 teams is too low for us to have a fighting chance against Mungoball, AFL and football.


That's why you need a Currie Cup, Mitre 10 cup equivalent instead of 2 weak city based club leagues. To try and piggy back that on super rugby is unrealistic and to be honest a bit up yourselves. It is essentially saying we are to lazy and too poor to organise our own shit can you guys (SA and NZ) keep us afloat.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:40 am 
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Crazy Ed wrote:
That's why you need a Currie Cup, Mitre 10 cup equivalent

We have one: NRC


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:46 am 
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kiap wrote:
Crazy Ed wrote:
That's why you need a Currie Cup, Mitre 10 cup equivalent

We have one: NRC


Yeha but we also have dumb rules that encourage basketball rugby and not good forward play which is stil the biggest weakness in Australian rugby. Most of the forwards we produce are soft. All they want to do is run wiht the ball and look liks showponies due to the Mungoball influen in Australia.
Also NRC is poorly promoted. No one knows exists and hardly anyone seem to care. Even the diehards don't seem to attend. I mean what's the average attendance like? less than 1K a game?

Australian rugby needs to get serious. Start promoting NRC properly and lets have test rugby rules and none of htis shite that encourages basketball rugby. Lets encourage the development of toug, hard workign forwards.
We need a plan to improve coaching at all levels. And have a long term plan to invest more in grass roots rugby. If we got those basics right we'll reap rewards in 5-10 years time. Too often our priorities are wrong. They are just happy to waste milliions chasing Mungoball stars which won't address the underlying problems in Australian rugby.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:48 am 
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Ok good point which I have missed despite living in Brisbane.
I heard about this about twice a year a few years ago and just assumed it had died a horrible death.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:49 am 
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TranceNRG wrote:
Yeha but we also have dumb rules that encourage basketball rugby

Let me test you here: Can you name these rules? (no googling!) :)


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:53 am 
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Keep the 15 teams but do away with the skewed conference system and flawed finals placings. Play each once and top 8 go through based on merit and quarter finals go to top 4. It's what got me excited about soup rugby (being an NPC & club rugby fan).

I know it wont suit everyone in terms of travel and local derbies but should be about 18 rounds (as it currently stands) including byes.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:55 am 
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The Crusaders would be on 1000 points and would be treated like gods

In fact the other teams would refuse to play them and just demand they be given the trophy out of pure awe.


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PostPosted: Sun Jun 16, 2019 11:55 am 
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Crazy Ed wrote:
Ok good point which I have missed despite living in Brisbane.
I heard about this about twice a year a few years ago and just assumed it had died a horrible death.

It might still die a death, but it hasn't yet!

If you still live in Brisvegas, view some games later in the year. All these comps are going to be in the shadow of the RWC, but it is what it is.

BTW ... many of the points I raise about rugby in Australia are not isolated here alone.

But if you think Souh Africa is in good health and immune, well, ... all I will say is good luck. :)


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