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Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African referees?
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Author:  guy smiley [ Fri May 24, 2019 10:56 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Average Joe wrote:
Yea like when one of our bent refs (considered to be one of the best at the time) helped the Ozzies beat Scotland. Not one salty tear in the house back then huh? Well except for the Scots but they're all cunts anyways.



There was a massive shitfight over that and it kept coming back up for a couple of years...

I guess you 'missed' that.

Author:  sorCrer [ Fri May 24, 2019 11:01 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Toro wrote:
Crazy Ed wrote:
Ok be pedantic. He made an incorrect call that should have been better.
Other Refs have made equally bad calls in the past which have also influenced potential game outcomes.


He showed a clear lack of understanding of something 'clarified in a video' by WR, with big lines on the field.
This wasn't a 50/50 call, he refused to use the clarifying points used by all referees in these circumstances, which is a reference to the hands and the ball leaving them.
The intervened in a crucial moment in the game and changed the outcome with a bad decision, that is a huge black mark for a ref.

As it's been mentioned, none of these points can be watered down by having to call it in real time, as TMO you have to be more accurate.

Games being influenced in the republic by dodgy TV crews and TMOs ignoring protocols is getting a bit tedious.


Yeah mate. I've seen games influenced all over the world by TMO's including in New Zealand.

Author:  JB1981 [ Fri May 24, 2019 11:06 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

sorCrer wrote:
Toro wrote:
Crazy Ed wrote:
Ok be pedantic. He made an incorrect call that should have been better.
Other Refs have made equally bad calls in the past which have also influenced potential game outcomes.


He showed a clear lack of understanding of something 'clarified in a video' by WR, with big lines on the field.
This wasn't a 50/50 call, he refused to use the clarifying points used by all referees in these circumstances, which is a reference to the hands and the ball leaving them.
The intervened in a crucial moment in the game and changed the outcome with a bad decision, that is a huge black mark for a ref.

As it's been mentioned, none of these points can be watered down by having to call it in real time, as TMO you have to be more accurate.

Games being influenced in the republic by dodgy TV crews and TMOs ignoring protocols is getting a bit tedious.


Yeah mate. I've seen games influenced all over the world by TMO's including in New Zealand.

Has anyone said TMOs don't have an influence elsewhere? This is one of worst, most erroneous cases though. What are similar examples, from anywhere? A TMO hall of shame if you will.

Author:  Toro [ Fri May 24, 2019 11:10 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

sorCrer wrote:
Toro wrote:
Crazy Ed wrote:
Ok be pedantic. He made an incorrect call that should have been better.
Other Refs have made equally bad calls in the past which have also influenced potential game outcomes.


He showed a clear lack of understanding of something 'clarified in a video' by WR, with big lines on the field.
This wasn't a 50/50 call, he refused to use the clarifying points used by all referees in these circumstances, which is a reference to the hands and the ball leaving them.
The intervened in a crucial moment in the game and changed the outcome with a bad decision, that is a huge black mark for a ref.

As it's been mentioned, none of these points can be watered down by having to call it in real time, as TMO you have to be more accurate.

Games being influenced in the republic by dodgy TV crews and TMOs ignoring protocols is getting a bit tedious.


Yeah mate. I've seen games influenced all over the world by TMO's including in New Zealand.


It's a crock and production crews in stadiums shouldn't be allowed to show replays until after tries have been awarded (or not) or when the ref wants to see it on the screen. It's a blight on the transparency of the game, and I'm sorry but they don't even try and hide it in SA.

Author:  Crazy Ed [ Fri May 24, 2019 11:43 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

The TV production angle is interesting but it does compare to teams taking a quick conversion when they know they got lucky to avoid potential review. In both cases people are making decisions that are slightly "off". Who is worse the player or the video editor?

It was also SA TV crews who exposed the Ozzie Cricketers as cheating plums. Had they not done the editorial on that world cricket would be a far worse place.

Author:  Average Joe [ Fri May 24, 2019 11:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

guy smiley wrote:
Average Joe wrote:
Yea like when one of our bent refs (considered to be one of the best at the time) helped the Ozzies beat Scotland. Not one salty tear in the house back then huh? Well except for the Scots but they're all cunts anyways.



There was a massive shitfight over that and it kept coming back up for a couple of years...

I guess you 'missed' that.

From the Scots yes but like I said no one cares as everyone knows they like moaning. They even chased poor old Joubert off the fokon pitch with their bitching and moaning. The ozzies (for a change) were so quite you could hear a pin drop.

Author:  handyman [ Fri May 24, 2019 12:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Fat Old Git wrote:
What colors do they come in?

This is SA, so black and white.

Author:  Toro [ Fri May 24, 2019 12:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Crazy Ed wrote:
The TV production angle is interesting but it does compare to teams taking a quick conversion when they know they got lucky to avoid potential review. In both cases people are making decisions that are slightly "off". Who is worse the player or the video editor?

It was also SA TV crews who exposed the Ozzie Cricketers as cheating plums. Had they not done the editorial on that world cricket would be a far worse place.


The problem is not what they pick up or not it’s that they only look for infractions from the visiting team which is where the transparency breaks down. They need a protocol to avoid such questions being asked.

Author:  handyman [ Fri May 24, 2019 1:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Toro wrote:
Crazy Ed wrote:
The TV production angle is interesting but it does compare to teams taking a quick conversion when they know they got lucky to avoid potential review. In both cases people are making decisions that are slightly "off". Who is worse the player or the video editor?

It was also SA TV crews who exposed the Ozzie Cricketers as cheating plums. Had they not done the editorial on that world cricket would be a far worse place.


The problem is not what they pick up or not it’s that they only look for infractions from the visiting team which is where the transparency breaks down. They need a protocol to avoid such questions being asked.

So that's 1 black armband for you?

Author:  Crazy Ed [ Fri May 24, 2019 1:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Prepare a shipment for NZ i think.

Author:  Average Joe [ Fri May 24, 2019 2:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

All this gekak and gekla from the Ozzies and Kiwis has bent our bent refs the other way. Peyper just let the Brumbies beat the Bulls. He even had Seconds there to help him.

Author:  jdogscoop [ Fri May 24, 2019 3:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Peyper is actually your one good ref. Please leave him out of this.

Author:  Lemoentjie [ Fri May 24, 2019 4:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

terangi48 wrote:
Is it right they got a weeks holiday........should have been a two year stand down, years revision course, cleaning out of betting account, compulsory resit of referees exams.....before being let anywhere near a rugby paddock again. Neutral refs please as used to be.....


Good to see the Kiwis are taking it well

Author:  Lemoentjie [ Fri May 24, 2019 4:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Didn't Joubert single handed drag NZ to victory over France in 2011 final...

Author:  Yourmother [ Fri May 24, 2019 6:42 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

sorCrer wrote:
Toro wrote:
Crazy Ed wrote:
Ok be pedantic. He made an incorrect call that should have been better.
Other Refs have made equally bad calls in the past which have also influenced potential game outcomes.


He showed a clear lack of understanding of something 'clarified in a video' by WR, with big lines on the field.
This wasn't a 50/50 call, he refused to use the clarifying points used by all referees in these circumstances, which is a reference to the hands and the ball leaving them.
The intervened in a crucial moment in the game and changed the outcome with a bad decision, that is a huge black mark for a ref.

As it's been mentioned, none of these points can be watered down by having to call it in real time, as TMO you have to be more accurate.

Games being influenced in the republic by dodgy TV crews and TMOs ignoring protocols is getting a bit tedious.


Yeah mate. I've seen games influenced all over the world by TMO's including in New Zealand.


Ones which have outright stated their decision before reviewing the footage?

“I’m going to show you a forward pass” were his actual comments before the replay review.

Author:  Toro [ Fri May 24, 2019 6:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Top ref that Craig. :thumbup:

Author:  Hong Kong [ Fri May 24, 2019 6:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Yourmother wrote:
sorCrer wrote:
Toro wrote:
Crazy Ed wrote:
Ok be pedantic. He made an incorrect call that should have been better.
Other Refs have made equally bad calls in the past which have also influenced potential game outcomes.


He showed a clear lack of understanding of something 'clarified in a video' by WR, with big lines on the field.
This wasn't a 50/50 call, he refused to use the clarifying points used by all referees in these circumstances, which is a reference to the hands and the ball leaving them.
The intervened in a crucial moment in the game and changed the outcome with a bad decision, that is a huge black mark for a ref.

As it's been mentioned, none of these points can be watered down by having to call it in real time, as TMO you have to be more accurate.

Games being influenced in the republic by dodgy TV crews and TMOs ignoring protocols is getting a bit tedious.


Yeah mate. I've seen games influenced all over the world by TMO's including in New Zealand.


Ones which have outright stated their decision before reviewing the footage?

“I’m going to show you a forward pass” were his actual comments before the replay review.


I’d like to think that Jonker had had a couple of views in between the pass and the try being scored before he intervened - not that that actually help him. If he did have the opportunity to view the pass at least once or twice before he made the call, he will be kicking himself for getting it so badly wrong

Author:  Yourmother [ Fri May 24, 2019 7:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Hong Kong wrote:
Yourmother wrote:
sorCrer wrote:
Toro wrote:
Crazy Ed wrote:
Ok be pedantic. He made an incorrect call that should have been better.
Other Refs have made equally bad calls in the past which have also influenced potential game outcomes.


He showed a clear lack of understanding of something 'clarified in a video' by WR, with big lines on the field.
This wasn't a 50/50 call, he refused to use the clarifying points used by all referees in these circumstances, which is a reference to the hands and the ball leaving them.
The intervened in a crucial moment in the game and changed the outcome with a bad decision, that is a huge black mark for a ref.

As it's been mentioned, none of these points can be watered down by having to call it in real time, as TMO you have to be more accurate.

Games being influenced in the republic by dodgy TV crews and TMOs ignoring protocols is getting a bit tedious.


Yeah mate. I've seen games influenced all over the world by TMO's including in New Zealand.


Ones which have outright stated their decision before reviewing the footage?

“I’m going to show you a forward pass” were his actual comments before the replay review.


I’d like to think that Jonker had had a couple of views in between the pass and the try being scored before he intervened - not that that actually help him. If he did have the opportunity to view the pass at least once or twice before he made the call, he will be kicking himself for getting it so badly wrong


You think he’s kicking himself. I think he will be saying it’s forward still. And saying forward is forward.

He had pre decided what the ref should rule, before he or more importantly the guy in charge was given the opportunity to properly forensically analyse.

Author:  Hong Kong [ Fri May 24, 2019 8:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Yourmother wrote:
Hong Kong wrote:

I’d like to think that Jonker had had a couple of views in between the pass and the try being scored before he intervened - not that that actually help him. If he did have the opportunity to view the pass at least once or twice before he made the call, he will be kicking himself for getting it so badly wrong


You think he’s kicking himself. I think he will be saying it’s forward still. And saying forward is forward.

He had pre decided what the ref should rule, before he or more importantly the guy in charge was given the opportunity to properly forensically analyse.

And if he does still think that, then he’ll soon be out of a job. It’s ridiculous to suggest he had a preconceived idea - he will have seen the pass, incorrectly thought it was forward and needed a review and having painted himself into a corner, stuck to his guns. Should have just said, ‘oops. Stuffed up, stick with your on field decision.’ The manner in which he spoke to the ref was very dominant and the ref will be infuriated that he did not have the courage to overrule Jonker.

Author:  Enzedder [ Fri May 24, 2019 8:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Lemoentjie wrote:
Didn't Joubert single handed drag NZ to victory over France in 2011 final...


As we found out in 2007 (and as we learned and used) the refs are told to put away their whistles in the knockout rounds of a world cup.

They are superfluous to requirements.

When games are whistled properly (e.g. 1987 and 2015) the finals are a piece of piss

Author:  naki [ Fri May 24, 2019 8:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Lemoentjie wrote:
Didn't Joubert single handed drag NZ to victory over France in 2011 final...


The likes of Jonker and Seconds need to learn from subtle masters like Joubert, who managed to gift the All Blacks victory by giving France kickable penalties to win the game and failing to card multiple acts of French foul play. Now that's how you Gold Watch.

Author:  Sandstorm [ Fri May 24, 2019 9:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

naki wrote:
Lemoentjie wrote:
Didn't Joubert single handed drag NZ to victory over France in 2011 final...


The likes of Jonker and Seconds need to learn from subtle masters like Joubert, who managed to gift the All Blacks victory by giving France kickable penalties to win the game and failing to card multiple acts of French foul play. Now that's how you Gold Watch.

Meh, NZ poor standard of refs over the last decade has been shielded by you lot getting into the last two RWC finals. Cock up in Sept and all will be exposed. :uhoh:

Author:  Toro [ Fri May 24, 2019 10:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Hong Kong wrote:
Yourmother wrote:
Hong Kong wrote:

I’d like to think that Jonker had had a couple of views in between the pass and the try being scored before he intervened - not that that actually help him. If he did have the opportunity to view the pass at least once or twice before he made the call, he will be kicking himself for getting it so badly wrong


You think he’s kicking himself. I think he will be saying it’s forward still. And saying forward is forward.

He had pre decided what the ref should rule, before he or more importantly the guy in charge was given the opportunity to properly forensically analyse.

And if he does still think that, then he’ll soon be out of a job. It’s ridiculous to suggest he had a preconceived idea - he will have seen the pass, incorrectly thought it was forward and needed a review and having painted himself into a corner, stuck to his guns. Should have just said, ‘oops. Stuffed up, stick with your on field decision.’ The manner in which he spoke to the ref was very dominant and the ref will be infuriated that he did not have the courage to overrule Jonker.


That's heresay really, you have no idea what his thought process was but seem to defend him and give him the benefit of the doubt as per. He completely ignored the usual protocol when talking of forward passes and went completely against a kiddies videos explaining a forward pass. He's in international TMO, gimme a f'n break.

Author:  Mr Mike [ Fri May 24, 2019 11:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Toro wrote:
Hong Kong wrote:
Yourmother wrote:
Hong Kong wrote:

I’d like to think that Jonker had had a couple of views in between the pass and the try being scored before he intervened - not that that actually help him. If he did have the opportunity to view the pass at least once or twice before he made the call, he will be kicking himself for getting it so badly wrong


You think he’s kicking himself. I think he will be saying it’s forward still. And saying forward is forward.

He had pre decided what the ref should rule, before he or more importantly the guy in charge was given the opportunity to properly forensically analyse.

And if he does still think that, then he’ll soon be out of a job. It’s ridiculous to suggest he had a preconceived idea - he will have seen the pass, incorrectly thought it was forward and needed a review and having painted himself into a corner, stuck to his guns. Should have just said, ‘oops. Stuffed up, stick with your on field decision.’ The manner in which he spoke to the ref was very dominant and the ref will be infuriated that he did not have the courage to overrule Jonker.


That's heresay really, you have no idea what his thought process was but seem to defend him and give him the benefit of the doubt as per. He completely ignored the usual protocol when talking of forward passes and went completely against a kiddies videos explaining a forward pass. He's in international TMO, gimme a f'n break.
Speculation rather than hearsay, I’ll allow it.

Author:  Toro [ Fri May 24, 2019 11:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

:frown:

Author:  brat [ Fri May 24, 2019 11:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Lemoentjie wrote:
Didn't Joubert single handed drag NZ to victory over France in 2011 final...


No that was mccaw

Author:  Hong Kong [ Fri May 24, 2019 11:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Mr Mike wrote:
Toro wrote:
Hong Kong wrote:
Yourmother wrote:
Hong Kong wrote:

I’d like to think that Jonker had had a couple of views in between the pass and the try being scored before he intervened - not that that actually help him. If he did have the opportunity to view the pass at least once or twice before he made the call, he will be kicking himself for getting it so badly wrong


You think he’s kicking himself. I think he will be saying it’s forward still. And saying forward is forward.

He had pre decided what the ref should rule, before he or more importantly the guy in charge was given the opportunity to properly forensically analyse.

And if he does still think that, then he’ll soon be out of a job. It’s ridiculous to suggest he had a preconceived idea - he will have seen the pass, incorrectly thought it was forward and needed a review and having painted himself into a corner, stuck to his guns. Should have just said, ‘oops. Stuffed up, stick with your on field decision.’ The manner in which he spoke to the ref was very dominant and the ref will be infuriated that he did not have the courage to overrule Jonker.


That's heresay really, you have no idea what his thought process was but seem to defend him and give him the benefit of the doubt as per. He completely ignored the usual protocol when talking of forward passes and went completely against a kiddies videos explaining a forward pass. He's in international TMO, gimme a f'n break.
Speculation rather than hearsay, I’ll allow it.


Phew!

As for defending Jonker, I have already said it was a bad decision but rather than froth at the mouth as some here have, I try and rationalise why a bad call was made.

Author:  Fat Old Git [ Fri May 24, 2019 11:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

naki wrote:
Lemoentjie wrote:
Didn't Joubert single handed drag NZ to victory over France in 2011 final...


The likes of Jonker and Seconds need to learn from subtle masters like Joubert, who managed to gift the All Blacks victory by giving France kickable penalties to win the game and failing to card multiple acts of French foul play. Now that's how you Gold Watch.


The claims about 2011 have always been a bit lazy.

"The ref must have helped the All Blacks because we know in our hearts that they're afraid to ref the All Cheats and McCheat properly."

Forget that the penalty count was fairly even for most of the game. Forget the foul play against the All Blacks that didn't get called. Or that we can't name any controversial calls that favored the them. We'll just repeat the claim over and over.

Author:  Yourmother [ Sat May 25, 2019 3:01 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Fat Old Git wrote:
naki wrote:
Lemoentjie wrote:
Didn't Joubert single handed drag NZ to victory over France in 2011 final...


The likes of Jonker and Seconds need to learn from subtle masters like Joubert, who managed to gift the All Blacks victory by giving France kickable penalties to win the game and failing to card multiple acts of French foul play. Now that's how you Gold Watch.


The claims about 2011 have always been a bit lazy.

"The ref must have helped the All Blacks because we know in our hearts that they're afraid to ref the All Cheats and McCheat properly."

Forget that the penalty count was fairly even for most of the game. Forget the foul play against the All Blacks that didn't get called. Or that we can't name any controversial calls that favored the them. We'll just repeat the claim over and over.


Or that the French score was a result of a Frenchy illegally coming around a ruck offside and hoofing it out with his boot.

Author:  Yourmother [ Sat May 25, 2019 3:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Toro wrote:
Hong Kong wrote:
Yourmother wrote:
Hong Kong wrote:

I’d like to think that Jonker had had a couple of views in between the pass and the try being scored before he intervened - not that that actually help him. If he did have the opportunity to view the pass at least once or twice before he made the call, he will be kicking himself for getting it so badly wrong


You think he’s kicking himself. I think he will be saying it’s forward still. And saying forward is forward.

He had pre decided what the ref should rule, before he or more importantly the guy in charge was given the opportunity to properly forensically analyse.

And if he does still think that, then he’ll soon be out of a job. It’s ridiculous to suggest he had a preconceived idea - he will have seen the pass, incorrectly thought it was forward and needed a review and having painted himself into a corner, stuck to his guns. Should have just said, ‘oops. Stuffed up, stick with your on field decision.’ The manner in which he spoke to the ref was very dominant and the ref will be infuriated that he did not have the courage to overrule Jonker.


That's heresay really, you have no idea what his thought process was but seem to defend him and give him the benefit of the doubt as per. He completely ignored the usual protocol when talking of forward passes and went completely against a kiddies videos explaining a forward pass. He's in international TMO, gimme a f'n break.


“It’s ridiculous to suggest he had a preconceived idea”

“he will have seen the pass, incorrectly thought it was forward and needed a review”

“having painted himself into a corner, stuck to his guns.”

All in the same sentence HK.

Author:  Hong Kong [ Sat May 25, 2019 9:50 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Yourmother wrote:
Toro wrote:
Hong Kong wrote:
Yourmother wrote:
Hong Kong wrote:

I’d like to think that Jonker had had a couple of views in between the pass and the try being scored before he intervened - not that that actually help him. If he did have the opportunity to view the pass at least once or twice before he made the call, he will be kicking himself for getting it so badly wrong


You think he’s kicking himself. I think he will be saying it’s forward still. And saying forward is forward.

He had pre decided what the ref should rule, before he or more importantly the guy in charge was given the opportunity to properly forensically analyse.

And if he does still think that, then he’ll soon be out of a job. It’s ridiculous to suggest he had a preconceived idea - he will have seen the pass, incorrectly thought it was forward and needed a review and having painted himself into a corner, stuck to his guns. Should have just said, ‘oops. Stuffed up, stick with your on field decision.’ The manner in which he spoke to the ref was very dominant and the ref will be infuriated that he did not have the courage to overrule Jonker.


That's heresay really, you have no idea what his thought process was but seem to defend him and give him the benefit of the doubt as per. He completely ignored the usual protocol when talking of forward passes and went completely against a kiddies videos explaining a forward pass. He's in international TMO, gimme a f'n break.


“It’s ridiculous to suggest he had a preconceived idea”

“he will have seen the pass, incorrectly thought it was forward and needed a review”

“having painted himself into a corner, stuck to his guns.”

All in the same sentence HK.


And all of which are far more likely than he had a preconceived idea that he was going to call a forward pass.

Author:  jdogscoop [ Sat May 25, 2019 10:03 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

I'm sure we can at least agree on the fact Jonker is a shit TMO and everyone, of all stripes, is going to question every one of his decisions from this point on.

:smug: :thumbup:

Author:  Hong Kong [ Sat May 25, 2019 10:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

jdogscoop wrote:
I'm sure we can at least agree on the fact Jonker is a shit TMO and everyone, of all stripes, is going to question every one of his decisions from this point on.

:smug: :thumbup:

:lol: and no. He made a bad call during a game and will, hopefully, be a better TMO as a result. After all, you don’t drop a player for a missed tackle or PK given away and call him a shit player forevermore, do you?

Author:  Kiwias [ Sat May 25, 2019 10:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Hong Kong wrote:
jdogscoop wrote:
I'm sure we can at least agree on the fact Jonker is a shit TMO and everyone, of all stripes, is going to question every one of his decisions from this point on.

:smug: :thumbup:

:lol: and no. He made a bad call during a game and will, hopefully, be a better TMO as a result. After all, you don’t drop a player for a missed tackle or PK given away and call him a shit player forevermore, do you?


Hell, yes. One missed touch kick and it took winning a WC to make amends.

Author:  Yourmother [ Sat May 25, 2019 6:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Hong Kong wrote:
Yourmother wrote:
Toro wrote:
Hong Kong wrote:
Yourmother wrote:

You think he’s kicking himself. I think he will be saying it’s forward still. And saying forward is forward.

He had pre decided what the ref should rule, before he or more importantly the guy in charge was given the opportunity to properly forensically analyse.

And if he does still think that, then he’ll soon be out of a job. It’s ridiculous to suggest he had a preconceived idea - he will have seen the pass, incorrectly thought it was forward and needed a review and having painted himself into a corner, stuck to his guns. Should have just said, ‘oops. Stuffed up, stick with your on field decision.’ The manner in which he spoke to the ref was very dominant and the ref will be infuriated that he did not have the courage to overrule Jonker.


That's heresay really, you have no idea what his thought process was but seem to defend him and give him the benefit of the doubt as per. He completely ignored the usual protocol when talking of forward passes and went completely against a kiddies videos explaining a forward pass. He's in international TMO, gimme a f'n break.


“It’s ridiculous to suggest he had a preconceived idea”

“he will have seen the pass, incorrectly thought it was forward and needed a review”

“having painted himself into a corner, stuck to his guns.”

All in the same sentence HK.


And all of which are far more likely than he had a preconceived idea that he was going to call a forward pass.


He preconceived it was a forward pass in your own words. And you’re watering it down just saying he thought it needed a review, despite him saying “I’m going to show you a forward pass”. And you also contradict this balanced review call by saying he stuck to his guns having painted himself in to a corner, which rather suggests there was a “tiny” bit of predisposition initially.

I know he’s a fellow ref to you HK, and you have a moral obligation to back up your fellows, but just how many hand jobs can you physically hand out! You need a rest.

Author:  Hong Kong [ Sat May 25, 2019 8:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Yourmother wrote:
Hong Kong wrote:

And all of which are far more likely than he had a preconceived idea that he was going to call a forward pass.


He preconceived it was a forward pass in your own words. And you’re watering it down just saying he thought it needed a review, despite him saying “I’m going to show you a forward pass”. And you also contradict this balanced review call by saying he stuck to his guns having painted himself in to a corner, which rather suggests there was a “tiny” bit of predisposition initially.

I know he’s a fellow ref to you HK, and you have a moral obligation to back up your fellows, but just how many hand jobs can you physically hand out! You need a rest.

:lol: two at any one time.

Author:  Rinkals [ Tue May 28, 2019 10:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

The problem for me is that there are no repercussions.

Was there anything on the coverage that the TMO was viewing that was so damning, so "clear and compelling" that Jonker had to over-rule the on-field referee and both touch judges in awarding the try? It has been universally condemned as the wrong call, so why did he do it? It was a huge call which decided the match, surely you have to be absolutely certain before you intervene? Unless, of course, it is your intention to alter the course of the match.

While we would want to presume innocence, I find it hard to believe that this was a simple mistake. The problem is that the Officials themselves close ranks to protect the individual. Even if the call was simply a mistake, the sport owes it to the supporters and participants to make sure that such calls merit more than a gentle slap in the wrist.

Otherwise it will just happen again.

Author:  Hong Kong [ Tue May 28, 2019 12:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Rinks - Jonker was ‘punished’ - he was dropped from this week’s fixtures and, assumption on my behalf but with very good reason, will have been told that a fuck up like that again will cost him in future fixtures, quite possibly the RWC

Author:  Kiwias [ Tue May 28, 2019 1:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

Hong Kong wrote:
Rinks - Jonker was ‘punished’ - he was dropped from this week’s fixtures and, assumption on my behalf but with very good reason, will have been told that a fuck up like that again will cost him in future fixtures, quite possibly the RWC


The rebuke was also made public, which increases the impact on Jonker.

Author:  sorCrer [ Tue May 28, 2019 2:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Are we back to the 'bad old days' of South African refer

In other news: https://www.rugbypass.com/news/world-ru ... er-charge/

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