The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

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clydecloggie
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by clydecloggie »

Congrats Leinster, well deserved. You sucked the life and joy out of that match like only you and Schmidt's Ireland can do and bloody hell it's effective.

Glasgow didn't find the answers; the rain didn't help and there's a decent what-if to be had if the second half scrum penalty for the wheeling scrum would have gone to the dominant side in that scrum, but overall they were clearly second best in that final and despite the 3-point difference it never really felt like a close match.
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slick
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by slick »

lorcanoworms wrote:
dargotronV.1 wrote:Kearney was lucky not to see red, I thought, for the way Hogg landed on his head.

Glasgow will feel they lost that with the Hogg charge down the difference, but Leinster deserved the win imo. Suffocated Glasgow second half. OK, they were dull dull dull in getting there but it was very effective.
A red because because yellow is not working, these in the air stupid tackles are still happening.
Dull? I thought Leinster made a lot of breaks from deep, but just couldn't find each other or panicked.
Handling is poor.
My reaction was red, but to be perfectly honest I’ve no idea where we are with it at the moment. A year ago it was unquestionably red, absolutely no doubt, but they seem to have slackened off recently. It’s a bit of a shit show.
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CM11
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by CM11 »

Leinster running on fumes in the second half and our bench isn't as strong as it used to be.

I think not taking the 3 points was balanced out by spending a load of time near their try line. Not convinced taking 3 would have definitely worked out better.

The pick and go going nowhere that we eventually gave up the penalty for is not really what we're used to from Leinster but given the aforementioned tiredness and conditions, I guess it was all they could manage, was clear it was going to end in a penalty at least 5 phases before it did though so someone should have tried to find the corner.

Tough 3 weekends for Leinster, glad we've something to show from it. Hard luck Glasgow.
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CM11
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by CM11 »

My initial reaction to Kearney's collision was straight red. I can see why Owens convinced himself yellow was OK but I wouldn't be surprised to see a citing.
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Hong Kong
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by Hong Kong »

CM11 wrote:My initial reaction to Kearney's collision was straight red. I can see why Owens convinced himself yellow was OK but I wouldn't be surprised to see a citing.
Is there a clip of the incident?
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by Rossco »

Hong Kong wrote:
CM11 wrote:My initial reaction to Kearney's collision was straight red. I can see why Owens convinced himself yellow was OK but I wouldn't be surprised to see a citing.
Is there a clip of the incident?
https://twitter.com/premiersportstv/sta ... 11553?s=21
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Mullet 2
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by Mullet 2 »

Another weekend, another Leinster win.
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by Nolanator »

Mullet 2 wrote:Another weekend, another Leinster trophy.
:thumbup:
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Willie Falloon
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by Willie Falloon »

That is a red card all day, every day.

Jared Payne got a red card for doing something similar in 2014. Owens bottled it.
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by iarmhiman »

Willie Falloon wrote:That is a red card all day, every day.

Jared Payne got a red card for doing something similar in 2014. Owens bottled it.
Hard luck Willie. Better luck next year
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camroc1
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by camroc1 »

Willie Falloon wrote:That is a red card all day, every day.

Jared Payne got a red card for doing something similar in 2014. Owens bottled it.
The interpretation has changed since then.

Land on the head = red

Land on neck/shoulder/back = yellow.

I wouldn't have been surprised at a red, but given Owens earlier cop out on the no arms blindside charge on a player not in possession of the ball, the YC also didn't surprise me.
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DiscoHips D'Arcy
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by DiscoHips D'Arcy »

Willie Falloon wrote:That is a red card all day, every day.

Jared Payne got a red card for doing something similar in 2014. Owens bottled it.
And the next season the exact same ref gave a wasps player a yellow when he did precisely the same to a Leinster player (think it may have been Daverage). Im not disagreeing with you but you can hardly say the officiating has been consistent in this area and Owens is out on his own in terms of deviating from it.
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Leinsterman
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by Leinsterman »

Still banging on about 2014 :lol:
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Liathroidigloine
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by Liathroidigloine »

Leinster might have been without a player for another 5 minutes but Glasgow should have been down a man for 10.
I like haggis
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by I like haggis »

camroc1 wrote:
Willie Falloon wrote:That is a red card all day, every day.

Jared Payne got a red card for doing something similar in 2014. Owens bottled it.
The interpretation has changed since then.

Land on the head = red

Land on neck/shoulder/back = yellow.

I wouldn't have been surprised at a red, but given Owens earlier cop out on the no arms blindside charge on a player not in possession of the ball, the YC also didn't surprise me.
Both decisions were definitely wrong.

In Kearney's case he wasn't targeting the ball at all, he jumped out 5cm off the ground. That should be a red, they should look at the contest not the result. But in the laws I understand.
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Smutley
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by Smutley »

Looked like a yellow to me in real time. On replay looks a bit worse so marginal red at worst. Given the leniency on Browns (also marginal) non-yellow, you could argue consistency. Gutted for Hogg on his last game for the Weegies. Also that it was his error that let them in at the start.

Congrats to Leinster on the win. Line speed and BR were excellent. Rode your luck, but deserved it in the end.

Great to see the form of Cummings and Fagerson, but Harley, Gibbins were outclassed.
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slick
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by slick »

Liathroidigloine wrote:Leinster might have been without a player for another 5 minutes but Glasgow should have been down a man for 10.
I’m tempted to give Owens the benefit of the doubt on both. The Brown one looked pretty crass but Owens said he believed the 9 genuinely had the ball so gave a bit of leeway. Kearny didn’t do out to injure Hogg, it was a just a crap challenge. I think it probably should have been red because it is so dangerous but I can see why in the context of the game he came up with the yellow.
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Duff Paddy
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by Duff Paddy »

Willie Falloon wrote:That is a red card all day, every day.

Jared Payne got a red card for doing something similar in 2014. Owens bottled it.
Nah, they haven’t been reffing it like that for ages now
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rfurlong
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by rfurlong »

slick wrote:
Liathroidigloine wrote:Leinster might have been without a player for another 5 minutes but Glasgow should have been down a man for 10.
I’m tempted to give Owens the benefit of the doubt on both. The Brown one looked pretty crass but Owens said he believed the 9 genuinely had the ball so gave a bit of leeway. Kearny didn’t do out to injure Hogg, it was a just a crap challenge. I think it probably should have been red because it is so dangerous but I can see why in the context of the game he came up with the yellow.
Don’t think the ref or the decisions made a blind bit of difference to the result

Kearney could have easily gotten red, while brown was lucky also. Luke McGrath was actually in the air when he was blindsided without the ball, while at least Kearney only had eyes for the ball ....

Glasgow need to have a word with their fans ..... it’s not soccer ffs

Same as the Munster fans last week, Glasgow fans need to understand that deliberately wheeling the scrum does not equal scrum dominance

Leinster refused to play basketball and got the job done ..... wasn’t pretty but it was a final and we were clinical

Glasgow are really on the up with rennie and are a good shout for the league and Europe next season

Finally - really impressed with Cummings
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topofthemoon
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by topofthemoon »

camroc1 wrote:
Willie Falloon wrote:That is a red card all day, every day.

Jared Payne got a red card for doing something similar in 2014. Owens bottled it.
The interpretation has changed since then.

Land on the head = red

Land on neck/shoulder/back = yellow.

I wouldn't have been surprised at a red, but given Owens earlier cop out on the no arms blindside charge on a player not in possession of the ball, the YC also didn't surprise me.
That was the previous guidance no? The most recent update, operating since 2016, was:
Penalty only – Fair challenge with wrong timing - No pulling down
Yellow card – Not a fair challenge, there is no contest and the player is pulled down landing on his back or side
Red card – It’s not a fair challenge with no contest, whilst being a reckless or deliberate foul play action and the player lands in a dangerous position
So back or side is yellow. Which by process of elimination suggests that 'a dangerous position' covers head, neck, shoulders and upper body.

If you were walking through that as a mental tick list as an official I'm not sure how you come to any decision other than red.
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nardol
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by nardol »

By noticing hogg didn't land in his neck or head
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slick
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by slick »

rfurlong wrote:
slick wrote:
Liathroidigloine wrote:Leinster might have been without a player for another 5 minutes but Glasgow should have been down a man for 10.
I’m tempted to give Owens the benefit of the doubt on both. The Brown one looked pretty crass but Owens said he believed the 9 genuinely had the ball so gave a bit of leeway. Kearny didn’t do out to injure Hogg, it was a just a crap challenge. I think it probably should have been red because it is so dangerous but I can see why in the context of the game he came up with the yellow.
Don’t think the ref or the decisions made a blind bit of difference to the result

Kearney could have easily gotten red, while brown was lucky also. Luke McGrath was actually in the air when he was blindsided without the ball, while at least Kearney only had eyes for the ball ....

Glasgow need to have a word with their fans ..... it’s not soccer ffs

Same as the Munster fans last week, Glasgow fans need to understand that deliberately wheeling the scrum does not equal scrum dominance

Leinster refused to play basketball and got the job done ..... wasn’t pretty but it was a final and we were clinical

Glasgow are really on the up with rennie and are a good shout for the league and Europe next season

Finally - really impressed with Cummings
This is a really poor post in many respects
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topofthemoon
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by topofthemoon »

nardol wrote:By noticing hogg didn't land in his neck or head
Surely, given the guidance I've quoted above, if he noticed he didn't land on his back or side then it should not have been a yellow card?

The head or neck thing went away back in 2016 for tackles in the air.
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by The Sun God »

dargotronV.1 wrote:
Conspicuous wrote:
rfurlong wrote:
Disappointing experience. Glasgow fans heckling Leinster players as they warm up, swearing at ref over every decision, booing the kicker - terrible rugby etiquette. Venue didn’t take card payments. After match surrounding area full of sectarian football fans. Bit shit Pro14...
Comment from neutral fan at today’s match
Where did you take this from ? A few people on FB saying the atmosphere at the match was pretty toxic . I watched the game in a busy pub so couldn’t hear much
Atmosphere wasn't toxic, was great from what I heard :thumbup:
It was total shit. Very nasty element in the stadium, a lot of whom had never been to rugby match in their lives listening to the stupid comments about the 'rules' from where I was sitting.
No respect for the winners or indeed their own team as the stadium emptied before the medals were handed out. Been to a lot of finals, this was the worst venue and crowd I have ever witnessed.
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Mullet 2
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by Mullet 2 »

That's a shame to hear, looked great on the TV.
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The Sun God
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by The Sun God »

Mullet 2 wrote:That's a shame to hear, looked great on the TV.
I actually haven't watched it back yet as I am still in the UK. Never been to Parkhead before........won't be rushing back.
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by lorcanoworms »

slick wrote:
Liathroidigloine wrote:Leinster might have been without a player for another 5 minutes but Glasgow should have been down a man for 10.
I’m tempted to give Owens the benefit of the doubt on both. The Brown one looked pretty crass but Owens said he believed the 9 genuinely had the ball so gave a bit of leeway. Kearny didn’t do out to injure Hogg, it was a just a crap challenge. I think it probably should have been red because it is so dangerous but I can see why in the context of the game he came up with the yellow.
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by Mullet 2 »

sewa wrote:Nigel Leinster Owens

Very unruggerlike

You don't like to see it
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by Liathroidigloine »

Mullet 2 wrote:
sewa wrote:Nigel Leinster Owens

Very unruggerlike

You don't like to see it
The southern province used to thrive on bitterness, now it eats them.
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by iarmhiman »

This is the same Nigel who gifted Munster their 2nd Heineken Cup in 2008 by allowing them to seal off every ruck. That Nigel?
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sewa
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by sewa »

Mullet 2 wrote:
sewa wrote:Nigel Leinster Owens

Very unruggerlike

You don't like to see it
Well given you are all doing it no point me maintaining a line in the sand
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by dargotronV.1 »

The Sun God wrote:
dargotronV.1 wrote:
Conspicuous wrote:
rfurlong wrote:
Disappointing experience. Glasgow fans heckling Leinster players as they warm up, swearing at ref over every decision, booing the kicker - terrible rugby etiquette. Venue didn’t take card payments. After match surrounding area full of sectarian football fans. Bit shit Pro14...
Comment from neutral fan at today’s match
Where did you take this from ? A few people on FB saying the atmosphere at the match was pretty toxic . I watched the game in a busy pub so couldn’t hear much
Atmosphere wasn't toxic, was great from what I heard :thumbup:
It was total shit. Very nasty element in the stadium, a lot of whom had never been to rugby match in their lives listening to the stupid comments about the 'rules' from where I was sitting.
No respect for the winners or indeed their own team as the stadium emptied before the medals were handed out. Been to a lot of finals, this was the worst venue and crowd I have ever witnessed.
I'm sure they would have been grateful for you to be there educating them.
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Mullet 2
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by Mullet 2 »

sewa wrote:
Mullet 2 wrote:
sewa wrote:Nigel Leinster Owens

Very unruggerlike

You don't like to see it
Well given you are all doing it no point me maintaining a line in the sand

Very boorish altogether
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by The Sun God »

dargotronV.1 wrote:
The Sun God wrote:
dargotronV.1 wrote:
rfurlong wrote:
Disappointing experience. Glasgow fans heckling Leinster players as they warm up, swearing at ref over every decision, booing the kicker - terrible rugby etiquette. Venue didn’t take card payments. After match surrounding area full of sectarian football fans. Bit shit Pro14...
Comment from neutral fan at today’s match

Atmosphere wasn't toxic, was great from what I heard :thumbup:
It was total shit. Very nasty element in the stadium, a lot of whom had never been to rugby match in their lives listening to the stupid comments about the 'rules' from where I was sitting.
No respect for the winners or indeed their own team as the stadium emptied before the medals were handed out. Been to a lot of finals, this was the worst venue and crowd I have ever witnessed.
I'm sure they would have been grateful for you to be there educating them.
Why would I be arsed doing that ?. Much better to leave them wallow in their ignorance.
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by Trostan »

The Sun God wrote:
dargotronV.1 wrote:
Conspicuous wrote:
rfurlong wrote:
Disappointing experience. Glasgow fans heckling Leinster players as they warm up, swearing at ref over every decision, booing the kicker - terrible rugby etiquette. Venue didn’t take card payments. After match surrounding area full of sectarian football fans. Bit shit Pro14...
Comment from neutral fan at today’s match
Where did you take this from ? A few people on FB saying the atmosphere at the match was pretty toxic . I watched the game in a busy pub so couldn’t hear much
Atmosphere wasn't toxic, was great from what I heard :thumbup:
It was total shit. Very nasty element in the stadium, a lot of whom had never been to rugby match in their lives listening to the stupid comments about the 'rules' from where I was sitting.
No respect for the winners or indeed their own team as the stadium emptied before the medals were handed out. Been to a lot of finals, this was the worst venue and crowd I have ever witnessed.
Pretty much agree with all of that. Lots of foul-mouthed shouting with booing, laughing while they did it.
What a contrast to Newcastle HEC or Edinburgh 2009, where the stadia was full rugby heads, who respected the match.
Would not go back to a soccer stadium in Scotland.
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by Jumper »

iarmhiman wrote:This is the same Nigel who gifted Munster their 2nd Heineken Cup in 2008 by allowing them to seal off every ruck. That Nigel?
11 years later and he allowed Leinster to do the same to get their win. :lol: :lol:
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Mullet 2
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by Mullet 2 »

Is it 11 years since your last European Cup?
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camroc1
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by camroc1 »

Jumper wrote:
iarmhiman wrote:This is the same Nigel who gifted Munster their 2nd Heineken Cup in 2008 by allowing them to seal off every ruck. That Nigel?
11 years later and he allowed Leinster to do the same to get their win. :lol: :lol:
Not really.

You did notice he penalised Leinster for "sealing off", from which possession Glasgow scored their final try ?

You appear to watch different matches to the rest of us.
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by dargotronV.1 »

The Sun God wrote:
dargotronV.1 wrote:I'm sure they would have been grateful for you to be there educating them.
Why would I be arsed doing that ?. Much better to leave them wallow in their ignorance.
Yes, and then come on here and whine about it :roll:
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Re: The Official Pro 14 Final Thread

Post by The Sun God »

dargotronV.1 wrote:
The Sun God wrote:
dargotronV.1 wrote:I'm sure they would have been grateful for you to be there educating them.
Why would I be arsed doing that ?. Much better to leave them wallow in their ignorance.
Yes, and then come on here and whine about it :roll:
Not at all I ( a person who bothered their bollocks to go to the game ) was answering a comment that you ( A person who didn't ) made about the atmosphere in the ground. This is a Rugby forum after-all.
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