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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:44 pm 
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Right, let's forget about this world cup, and focus on the next one conveniently played in France. I think France will do with its appalling last 10 years of under par performances and come back to the forefront.

With back to back U20 world championships won in the last 2 years, there are signs that finally the FFR is getting things right. A number of young talents are coming through the ranks of the professional clubs and are getting decent game time, which wasn't the case in the past.

I can see France finally come back to battling regularly for the 6N title instead of fighting for the woodenspoon with Italy and Scotland, and threatening the SH teams home and away.

This is what the French squad could look like in the coming years:

LHP: Jefferson Poirot (capt), Cyril Baille, Danny Prisot, Jean-Baptiste Gros

Hookers: Julien Marchand, Camille Chat, Guillaume Marchand, Peato Mauvaka, Pierre Bourgarit

THP: Rabah Slimani, Demba Bemba, Emerick Setiano, Danniel Brennan

Locks: Sebastien Vahaamahina, Paul Gabrillagues, Killian Geraci, Felix Lambey, Paul Jedrasiak, Thomas Jolmes, Mathieu Tanguy, Florient Verhaeghe

Backrow: Arthur Iturria, Yacouba Camara, Sekou Macalou, Fabien Sanconnie, Yoan Tanga, Cameron Woki, Francois Cros, Anthony Jelonch, Alexandre Fischer, Judicael Cancoriet, Dylan Cretin, Gregory Aldritt, Charles Ollivon, Jordan Joseph

Scrummies: Antoine Dupont, Jean-Baptiste Couilloud, Arthur Coville, Leo Coly

Fly-halves: Matthieu Jalibert, Louis Carbonnel, Antony Bellau

Centers: Gael Fickou, Romain N'tamack, Pierre-Louis Barassi, Julien Delbouis, Yvan Reilhac, Arthur Vincent

Wingers: Damian Penaud, Arthur Retiere, Alivereti Raka, Teddy Thomas, Lucas Tauzin, Martin Laveau, Vincent Pinto, Gabriel Ngandebe (the white Cheslin Kolbe :) )

Fullbacks: Thomas Ramos, Clement Laporte, Romain Buros, Gervais Cordin, Donovan Taofifenua, Matthis Lebel


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:49 pm 
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Looks like a decent crop - will French clubs put the chequebook away for their foreign purchases then?


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 8:04 pm 
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TheFrog wrote:
Right, let's forget about this world cup, and focus on the next one conveniently played in France. I think France will do with its appalling last 10 years of under par performances and come back to the forefront.
certainly hope so - it was the '99 game that made me a rugby superfan, and some of the French players of that era were heros of mine: Ibanez, Benazzi, Bernatt-Salle, Castaignede, Califano... too many to remember now.

But watching some of the performances over the last... I don't know how many years now has been a souless experience, and has really sucked some enjoyment out of the sport for me - every time I watch them play it seems to be a whole load of new, forgettable, faces who vanish without trace the following season.

Would be great to see France back and challenging again


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 8:13 pm 
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Back?


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 8:52 pm 
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Unless the conditioning regimes at the clubs improve then there’s little chance.

The size of Zebo these days. :shock:


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 8:56 pm 
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Crash_12 wrote:
Unless the conditioning regimes at the clubs improve then there’s little chance.

The size of Zebo these days. :shock:


This. I don't think the problem has ever been raw talent, it's the coaching and conditioning that is the French problem. If that doesn't change, then fuck all else will change.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:16 pm 
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Balls Out! wrote:
TheFrog wrote:
Right, let's forget about this world cup, and focus on the next one conveniently played in France. I think France will do with its appalling last 10 years of under par performances and come back to the forefront.
certainly hope so - it was the '99 game that made me a rugby superfan, and some of the French players of that era were heros of mine: Ibanez, Benazzi, Bernatt-Salle, Castaignede, Califano... too many to remember now.

But watching some of the performances over the last... I don't know how many years now has been a souless experience, and has really sucked some enjoyment out of the sport for me - every time I watch them play it seems to be a whole load of new, forgettable, faces who vanish without trace the following season.

Would be great to see France back and challenging again


10 years at least...

You should never forget that the 2011 miracle also included the first ever defeat for France against Tonga...


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:19 pm 
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Jeff the Bear wrote:
Crash_12 wrote:
Unless the conditioning regimes at the clubs improve then there’s little chance.

The size of Zebo these days. :shock:


This. I don't think the problem has ever been raw talent, it's the coaching and conditioning that is the French problem. If that doesn't change, then fuck all else will change.


Lack of first team rugby for youth players as well.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 9:24 pm 
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Enzedder wrote:
Looks like a decent crop - will French clubs put the chequebook away for their foreign purchases then?


More and more as the national league have agreed to measures putting obligations on French club to field a minimum amount of players coming from French rugby academies (under EU laws, you can't put any quota on nationalities, so they found this work around). This doesn't stop clubs from scouting young promising foreigners, mainly Fijians but also Saffas, Georgians etc... who become eligible under these rules. Some of them end up playing for France in the end, like Raka this year.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 10:19 pm 
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TheFrog wrote:
Right, let's forget about this world cup, and focus on the next one conveniently played in France. I think France will do with its appalling last 10 years of under par performances and come back to the forefront.

With back to back U20 world championships won in the last 2 years, there are signs that finally the FFR is getting things right. A number of young talents are coming through the ranks of the professional clubs and are getting decent game time, which wasn't the case in the past.

I can see France finally come back to battling regularly for the 6N title instead of fighting for the woodenspoon with Italy and Scotland, and threatening the SH teams home and away.

This is what the French squad could look like in the coming years:

LHP: Jefferson Poirot (capt), Cyril Baille, Danny Prisot, Jean-Baptiste Gros

Hookers: Julien Marchand, Camille Chat, Guillaume Marchand, Peato Mauvaka, Pierre Bourgarit

THP: Rabah Slimani, Demba Bemba, Emerick Setiano, Danniel Brennan

Locks: Sebastien Vahaamahina, Paul Gabrillagues, Killian Geraci, Felix Lambey, Paul Jedrasiak, Thomas Jolmes, Mathieu Tanguy, Florient Verhaeghe

Backrow: Arthur Iturria, Yacouba Camara, Sekou Macalou, Fabien Sanconnie, Yoan Tanga, Cameron Woki, Francois Cros, Anthony Jelonch, Alexandre Fischer, Judicael Cancoriet, Dylan Cretin, Gregory Aldritt, Charles Ollivon, Jordan Joseph

Scrummies: Antoine Dupont, Jean-Baptiste Couilloud, Arthur Coville, Leo Coly

Fly-halves: Matthieu Jalibert, Louis Carbonnel, Antony Bellau

Centers: Gael Fickou, Romain N'tamack, Pierre-Louis Barassi, Julien Delbouis, Yvan Reilhac, Arthur Vincent

Wingers: Damian Penaud, Arthur Retiere, Alivereti Raka, Teddy Thomas, Lucas Tauzin, Martin Laveau, Vincent Pinto, Gabriel Ngandebe (the white Cheslin Kolbe :) )

Fullbacks: Thomas Ramos, Clement Laporte, Romain Buros, Gervais Cordin, Donovan Taofifenua, Matthis Lebel



BACK to the top? France have never really even been near top.

In comparision to other teams - they are like pakistan cricket team but the lite version. Pakistan lite. Capable of pulling off big shocks at world events, difference being pakistan have won both the 50 over and t20 world cup (+ a champions trophy). France do one shock at a world cup then choke themselves usually. So pakistan lite is france's rugby history summed up.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 11:03 pm 
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Any other country and you would expect a decent side to emerge from this talent, but the Fr will appoint a coach who will see his job to do the most stupid things to prove how clever he is. BTW why hasn't Teddy Thomas been picked for the WC?


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 11:10 pm 
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Enzedder wrote:
Looks like a decent crop - will French clubs put the chequebook away for their foreign purchases then?


It's pretty irrelevant. France have like 30 pro teams, and play a billion games a year so if a French player is good enough, they'll get plenty of game time.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 12, 2019 11:53 pm 
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Jeff the Bear wrote:
Crash_12 wrote:
Unless the conditioning regimes at the clubs improve then there’s little chance.

The size of Zebo these days. :shock:


This. I don't think the problem has ever been raw talent, it's the coaching and conditioning that is the French problem. If that doesn't change, then fuck all else will change.


They’ve only beaten us once since 2011 :o

The Top14 is a mighty league though no doubt.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 5:26 am 
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French clubs won’t put away the cheque book. Clubs play 32 games a season minimum and test players have a limit on the amount of games they play. Season doesn’t tend to go on hiatus during test windows.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 5:43 am 
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A potential ABs 2023 squad would be interesting

Props
Laulala (31 at time of tournament)
Moody (34)
Moli (28)
Ofa (31)
Tu'inukuafe (30)

Hookers
Taylor (32)
Aumua (26)
Riccitelli (28)

Locks
Retallick (32)
S Barrett (29)
Tuipulotu (30)

Loose forwards
Savea (29)
Jacobson (26)
Cane (31)
Papalii (25)
Akira (28)

Half backs
TJ Perenara (30)
Enari (26)
Fakatava (23)

First fives
Moúnga (29)
J Ioane (28)
Falcon (26)

Centres
ALB (28)
Goodhue (28)
Laumape (30)
Ennor (26)

Wings
Bridge (28)
R Ioane (26)
Reece (26)

Fullbacks
DMac (28)
Jordan (25)


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 8:41 am 
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 11:08 am 
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Tuivasa wrote:
TheFrog wrote:
Right, let's forget about this world cup, and focus on the next one conveniently played in France. I think France will do with its appalling last 10 years of under par performances and come back to the forefront.

With back to back U20 world championships won in the last 2 years, there are signs that finally the FFR is getting things right. A number of young talents are coming through the ranks of the professional clubs and are getting decent game time, which wasn't the case in the past.

I can see France finally come back to battling regularly for the 6N title instead of fighting for the woodenspoon with Italy and Scotland, and threatening the SH teams home and away.

This is what the French squad could look like in the coming years:

LHP: Jefferson Poirot (capt), Cyril Baille, Danny Prisot, Jean-Baptiste Gros

Hookers: Julien Marchand, Camille Chat, Guillaume Marchand, Peato Mauvaka, Pierre Bourgarit

THP: Rabah Slimani, Demba Bemba, Emerick Setiano, Danniel Brennan

Locks: Sebastien Vahaamahina, Paul Gabrillagues, Killian Geraci, Felix Lambey, Paul Jedrasiak, Thomas Jolmes, Mathieu Tanguy, Florient Verhaeghe

Backrow: Arthur Iturria, Yacouba Camara, Sekou Macalou, Fabien Sanconnie, Yoan Tanga, Cameron Woki, Francois Cros, Anthony Jelonch, Alexandre Fischer, Judicael Cancoriet, Dylan Cretin, Gregory Aldritt, Charles Ollivon, Jordan Joseph

Scrummies: Antoine Dupont, Jean-Baptiste Couilloud, Arthur Coville, Leo Coly

Fly-halves: Matthieu Jalibert, Louis Carbonnel, Antony Bellau

Centers: Gael Fickou, Romain N'tamack, Pierre-Louis Barassi, Julien Delbouis, Yvan Reilhac, Arthur Vincent

Wingers: Damian Penaud, Arthur Retiere, Alivereti Raka, Teddy Thomas, Lucas Tauzin, Martin Laveau, Vincent Pinto, Gabriel Ngandebe (the white Cheslin Kolbe :) )

Fullbacks: Thomas Ramos, Clement Laporte, Romain Buros, Gervais Cordin, Donovan Taofifenua, Matthis Lebel



BACK to the top? France have never really even been near top.

In comparision to other teams - they are like pakistan cricket team but the lite version. Pakistan lite. Capable of pulling off big shocks at world events, difference being pakistan have won both the 50 over and t20 world cup (+ a champions trophy). France do one shock at a world cup then choke themselves usually. So pakistan lite is france's rugby history summed up.


France have belonged to the Top 4 teams regularly. The 1995 world cup team was in my opinion the best France had managed. The team had records winning a series in New Zealand and were on a par with the best teams at the world cup, behind New Zealand of course, but among the main outsiders. The 2007 team were a decent outfit too. 1987 was another great crop of French players and the 1999 squad, though they faded in the final, had two back to back grand slam to their records and a lot of talent.

Only since 2011 have France faded to the point of not even challenging for the 6N title.


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 11:27 am 
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TheFrog wrote:
Fullbacks: Thomas Ramos, Clement Laporte, Romain Buros, Gervais Cordin, Donovan Taofifenua, Matthis Lebel


Hopefully, we'll have a better fullback than this guy...


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 11:30 am 
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Tuivasa wrote:
TheFrog wrote:
Right, let's forget about this world cup, and focus on the next one conveniently played in France. I think France will do with its appalling last 10 years of under par performances and come back to the forefront.

With back to back U20 world championships won in the last 2 years, there are signs that finally the FFR is getting things right. A number of young talents are coming through the ranks of the professional clubs and are getting decent game time, which wasn't the case in the past.

I can see France finally come back to battling regularly for the 6N title instead of fighting for the woodenspoon with Italy and Scotland, and threatening the SH teams home and away.

This is what the French squad could look like in the coming years:

LHP: Jefferson Poirot (capt), Cyril Baille, Danny Prisot, Jean-Baptiste Gros

Hookers: Julien Marchand, Camille Chat, Guillaume Marchand, Peato Mauvaka, Pierre Bourgarit

THP: Rabah Slimani, Demba Bemba, Emerick Setiano, Danniel Brennan

Locks: Sebastien Vahaamahina, Paul Gabrillagues, Killian Geraci, Felix Lambey, Paul Jedrasiak, Thomas Jolmes, Mathieu Tanguy, Florient Verhaeghe

Backrow: Arthur Iturria, Yacouba Camara, Sekou Macalou, Fabien Sanconnie, Yoan Tanga, Cameron Woki, Francois Cros, Anthony Jelonch, Alexandre Fischer, Judicael Cancoriet, Dylan Cretin, Gregory Aldritt, Charles Ollivon, Jordan Joseph

Scrummies: Antoine Dupont, Jean-Baptiste Couilloud, Arthur Coville, Leo Coly

Fly-halves: Matthieu Jalibert, Louis Carbonnel, Antony Bellau

Centers: Gael Fickou, Romain N'tamack, Pierre-Louis Barassi, Julien Delbouis, Yvan Reilhac, Arthur Vincent

Wingers: Damian Penaud, Arthur Retiere, Alivereti Raka, Teddy Thomas, Lucas Tauzin, Martin Laveau, Vincent Pinto, Gabriel Ngandebe (the white Cheslin Kolbe :) )

Fullbacks: Thomas Ramos, Clement Laporte, Romain Buros, Gervais Cordin, Donovan Taofifenua, Matthis Lebel



BACK to the top? France have never really even been near top.

In comparision to other teams - they are like pakistan cricket team but the lite version. Pakistan lite. Capable of pulling off big shocks at world events, difference being pakistan have won both the 50 over and t20 world cup (+ a champions trophy). France do one shock at a world cup then choke themselves usually. So pakistan lite is france's rugby history summed up.


To a degree, you're right.
It's staggering to think that despite having achieved far more in RWCs than for example countries like Wales and Ireland, those last two have at least got to IRB number 1 ranking while France never achieved that (best we've achieved was number 2 in 2007).


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 13, 2019 4:29 pm 
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franch fan wrote:
Tuivasa wrote:
TheFrog wrote:
Right, let's forget about this world cup, and focus on the next one conveniently played in France. I think France will do with its appalling last 10 years of under par performances and come back to the forefront.

With back to back U20 world championships won in the last 2 years, there are signs that finally the FFR is getting things right. A number of young talents are coming through the ranks of the professional clubs and are getting decent game time, which wasn't the case in the past.

I can see France finally come back to battling regularly for the 6N title instead of fighting for the woodenspoon with Italy and Scotland, and threatening the SH teams home and away.

This is what the French squad could look like in the coming years:

LHP: Jefferson Poirot (capt), Cyril Baille, Danny Prisot, Jean-Baptiste Gros

Hookers: Julien Marchand, Camille Chat, Guillaume Marchand, Peato Mauvaka, Pierre Bourgarit

THP: Rabah Slimani, Demba Bemba, Emerick Setiano, Danniel Brennan

Locks: Sebastien Vahaamahina, Paul Gabrillagues, Killian Geraci, Felix Lambey, Paul Jedrasiak, Thomas Jolmes, Mathieu Tanguy, Florient Verhaeghe

Backrow: Arthur Iturria, Yacouba Camara, Sekou Macalou, Fabien Sanconnie, Yoan Tanga, Cameron Woki, Francois Cros, Anthony Jelonch, Alexandre Fischer, Judicael Cancoriet, Dylan Cretin, Gregory Aldritt, Charles Ollivon, Jordan Joseph

Scrummies: Antoine Dupont, Jean-Baptiste Couilloud, Arthur Coville, Leo Coly

Fly-halves: Matthieu Jalibert, Louis Carbonnel, Antony Bellau

Centers: Gael Fickou, Romain N'tamack, Pierre-Louis Barassi, Julien Delbouis, Yvan Reilhac, Arthur Vincent

Wingers: Damian Penaud, Arthur Retiere, Alivereti Raka, Teddy Thomas, Lucas Tauzin, Martin Laveau, Vincent Pinto, Gabriel Ngandebe (the white Cheslin Kolbe :) )

Fullbacks: Thomas Ramos, Clement Laporte, Romain Buros, Gervais Cordin, Donovan Taofifenua, Matthis Lebel



BACK to the top? France have never really even been near top.

In comparision to other teams - they are like pakistan cricket team but the lite version. Pakistan lite. Capable of pulling off big shocks at world events, difference being pakistan have won both the 50 over and t20 world cup (+ a champions trophy). France do one shock at a world cup then choke themselves usually. So pakistan lite is france's rugby history summed up.


To a degree, you're right.
It's staggering to think that despite having achieved far more in RWCs than for example countries like Wales and Ireland, those last two have at least got to IRB number 1 ranking while France never achieved that (best we've achieved was number 2 in 2007).

Never underachieving against ranking is the opposite of choking. It's not complicated.


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