Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

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6.Jones
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by 6.Jones »

Sundy wrote:By the sounds of it an airtanker has gone down in NSW

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2020-01-23/ ... e/11893554

With the fires it's easy to forget the hours of risk the plane and helicopter pilots put themselves in :(
:(( The heroes of this and many other disasters.
Sundy
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Sundy »

The charities are getting some serious bad press right now. Are we about to see some massive exposure here?
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Pat the Ex Mat
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Pat the Ex Mat »

The South Coast fires from NYE have re-ignited

Houses lost

:|
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Slim 293
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Slim 293 »

The southern suburbs of Canberra coming under threat from Namadgi fire... fears of a repeat of 2003.

https://www.theguardian.com/australia-n ... -live-news
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Pat the Ex Mat
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Pat the Ex Mat »

The next days weather is not looking good
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Lacrobat
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Lacrobat »

Vivid exemplar of the power of these fires:

https://9gag.com/gag/abrReYp
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Gavin Duffy
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Gavin Duffy »

That is f*cked up.
grievous
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by grievous »

Allan Jones spouting some shit from a looney biologist, it’s all the eucalyptus trees fault.we need to remove them.
I couldn’t even imagine how you do that or what other ecological issues it would create....think the right are getting desperate as big businesses has made serious noises about getting out of coal this week.
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EverReady
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by EverReady »

Gavin Duffy wrote:That is f*cked up.
Completely fücked up
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The Optimist
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by The Optimist »

EverReady wrote:
Gavin Duffy wrote:That is f*cked up.
Completely fücked up
When you see those home owners with their garden hoses... water is going to evaporate before it hits the ground.
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EverReady
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by EverReady »

The Optimist wrote:
EverReady wrote:
Gavin Duffy wrote:That is f*cked up.
Completely fücked up
When you see those home owners with their garden hoses... water is going to evaporate before it hits the ground.
Quite stupidly and naively I have often wondered how people get caught in these things. Now I know
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6.Jones
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by 6.Jones »

The Optimist wrote:
EverReady wrote:
Gavin Duffy wrote:That is f*cked up.
Completely fücked up
When you see those home owners with their garden hoses... water is going to evaporate before it hits the ground.
I think that's the point. At an early stage in a fire’s development, water should be used to directly douse the flames. When the fire is more intense the water should be sprayed in the air at the flames to remove the greatest amount of heat from the system. The radiant heat is the main danger.
Harvey2.0
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Harvey2.0 »

Is Muttonbird perma banned? This is the shit he's posting elsewhere.


Muttonbird
25 December 2019 at 9:58 pm
Anyone want to see Australia burn?

I do

https://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-25-12-2019/
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Fat Old Git
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Fat Old Git »

Lacrobat wrote:Vivid exemplar of the power of these fires:

https://9gag.com/gag/abrReYp
:shock:

What was the camera on? And was that heat simmer or water being sprayed on it during part of the footage? Hard to tell on my phone.
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guy smiley
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by guy smiley »

The camera is mounted close to the windscreen inside. The effect you see is the water curtain... several years ago after firefighters were trapped and killed in their vehicle in a fire, new standards were introduced to help safeguard personnel in the units... a water deluge system is fitted to protect the outside and heavy curtains are fitted inside to drop and provide a heat shield. There was another clip going around shot by someone on a phone from the back seat of a fire truck that showed the curtains being dropped.
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Fat Old Git
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Fat Old Git »

guy smiley wrote:The camera is mounted close to the windscreen inside. The effect you see is the water curtain... several years ago after firefighters were trapped and killed in their vehicle in a fire, new standards were introduced to help safeguard personnel in the units... a water deluge system is fitted to protect the outside and heavy curtains are fitted inside to drop and provide a heat shield. There was another clip going around shot by someone on a phone from the back seat of a fire truck that showed the curtains being dropped.
:thumbup:

Sounds like very sensible equipment to have on board.
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Shrekles
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Shrekles »

Fat Old Git wrote:
guy smiley wrote:The camera is mounted close to the windscreen inside. The effect you see is the water curtain... several years ago after firefighters were trapped and killed in their vehicle in a fire, new standards were introduced to help safeguard personnel in the units... a water deluge system is fitted to protect the outside and heavy curtains are fitted inside to drop and provide a heat shield. There was another clip going around shot by someone on a phone from the back seat of a fire truck that showed the curtains being dropped.
:thumbup:

Sounds like very sensible equipment to have on board.
If you see earlier in the thread there was a discussion about the fact that RFS vehicles are fitted with halo sprays - they are a ring that circles the top of the cab and sprays the crew cabin. They also have roll up heat shields that cover the windows. FRNSW vehicles do not have this equipment.
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Plastic Sarrie
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Plastic Sarrie »

Presumably because FRNSW is more urban based where you wouldn't need that kind of protection?
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mr bungle
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by mr bungle »

Harvey2.0 wrote:Is Muttonbird perma banned? This is the shit he's posting elsewhere.


Muttonbird
25 December 2019 at 9:58 pm
Anyone want to see Australia burn?

I do

https://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-25-12-2019/
Happy Xmas day for Muttonmong. x(
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Shrekles
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Shrekles »

Plastic Sarrie wrote:Presumably because FRNSW is more urban based where you wouldn't need that kind of protection?
That is correct - our vehicles are set up for bush or grassland firefighting. They are designed to work away from water sources, fiight moving fires, and to survive fire overuns. FRNSW vehicles are urban pumpers - they are designed to pull up to an incident, connect to the nearest large water supply and move vast amounts of water. They are great for the urban interface firefighting but are less usefull in the bush.
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MungoMan
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by MungoMan »

mr bungle wrote:
Harvey2.0 wrote:Is Muttonbird perma banned? This is the shit he's posting elsewhere.


Muttonbird
25 December 2019 at 9:58 pm
Anyone want to see Australia burn?

I do

https://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-25-12-2019/
Happy Xmas day for Muttonmong. x(
What if there really is two of them?

Two. Of. Them. :shock: :shock:
Harvey2.0
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Harvey2.0 »

MungoMan wrote:
mr bungle wrote:
Harvey2.0 wrote:Is Muttonbird perma banned? This is the shit he's posting elsewhere.


Muttonbird
25 December 2019 at 9:58 pm
Anyone want to see Australia burn?

I do

https://thestandard.org.nz/open-mike-25-12-2019/
Happy Xmas day for Muttonmong. x(
What if there really is two of them?

Two. Of. Them. :shock: :shock:
Its the same one . They've banned him there a couple of times too.
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Zakar
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Zakar »

Shrekles wrote:
Plastic Sarrie wrote:Presumably because FRNSW is more urban based where you wouldn't need that kind of protection?
That is correct - our vehicles are set up for bush or grassland firefighting. They are designed to work away from water sources, fiight moving fires, and to survive fire overuns. FRNSW vehicles are urban pumpers - they are designed to pull up to an incident, connect to the nearest large water supply and move vast amounts of water. They are great for the urban interface firefighting but are less usefull in the bush.
There is an investigation that's been opened to this fact. 4 Illawarra region FRNSW pumpers were sent down a road (by a junior controller at RFS incident command according to a rumour I heard) resulting in one subsequently nearly being lost. Raises two teams key questions in my mind

1. Why are they being used in such a dangerous way
2. If they're going to be used in this way, why weren't they equipped with Halos etc as standard.
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Shrekles
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Shrekles »

They are not supposed to be used in that way. One of the things that will come out of this fire season is that I think FRNSW will get a lot more bush tankers - they have a few but I reckon they will get about 50 more.
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Zakar
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Zakar »

Shrekles wrote:They are not supposed to be used in that way. One of the things that will come out of this fire season is that I think FRNSW will get a lot more bush tankers - they have a few but I reckon they will get about 50 more.

Well yes, exactly. I agree with more 4x4 pumpers. There might be a niche for hybrid units that can hook through rough terrain. If it was me, I'd expand FRNSW. They have the infrastructure (with many 'retained' stations), and they take less than 1% of applicants annually by all accounts.
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Shrekles
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Shrekles »

Zakar wrote:
Shrekles wrote:They are not supposed to be used in that way. One of the things that will come out of this fire season is that I think FRNSW will get a lot more bush tankers - they have a few but I reckon they will get about 50 more.

Well yes, exactly. I agree with more 4x4 pumpers. There might be a niche for hybrid units that can hook through rough terrain. If it was me, I'd expand FRNSW. They have the infrastructure (with many 'retained' stations), and they take less than 1% of applicants annually by all accounts.
By pumpers do you mean the vehicles with PTO off the main engine for their pumps? The RFS has several of those 'urban pumpers' - they are great for moving vast amounts of water but less useful in the bush.

FRNSW has a few of these. They are almost identical to our bush tankers with all the safety equipment - I suspect they will get at least one for every major station over the next few years.

ImageImage
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Zakar
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Zakar »

Shrekles wrote:
Zakar wrote:
Shrekles wrote:They are not supposed to be used in that way. One of the things that will come out of this fire season is that I think FRNSW will get a lot more bush tankers - they have a few but I reckon they will get about 50 more.

Well yes, exactly. I agree with more 4x4 pumpers. There might be a niche for hybrid units that can hook through rough terrain. If it was me, I'd expand FRNSW. They have the infrastructure (with many 'retained' stations), and they take less than 1% of applicants annually by all accounts.
By pumpers do you mean the vehicles with PTO off the main engine for their pumps? The RFS has several of those 'urban pumpers' - they are great for moving vast amounts of water but less useful in the bush.

FRNSW has a few of these. They are almost identical to our bush tankers with all the safety equipment - I suspect they will get at least one for every major station over the next few years.

ImageImage
Is that based on the NPS 300? Its a hell of a truck.
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Shrekles
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Shrekles »

No idea which model Isuzu it is but they are the same base model and fitted out by the same company.

They are good trucks but have one major flaw in that they can only handle a cross slope of 13 degrees before they are in danger of rolling over.
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Zakar
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Zakar »

Shrekles wrote:No idea which model Isuzu it is but they are the same base model and fitted out by the same company.

They are good trucks but have one major flaw in that they can only handle a cross slope of 13 degrees before they are in danger of rolling over.
That's kind of inevitable with a 4x4 truck of that size and height. Maybe a unimog woukd be better, albeit at 3x the price.
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Shrekles
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Shrekles »

They apparently have similar stability problems. The problem is caused by the large water tank so far above the centre of gravity - this is why we use the smaller category 7s and 9s in rugged bush land and use the Category 1s as support vehicles.

http://www.kuipers.com.au/fire-fighting-vehicles
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JPNZ
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by JPNZ »

Good to see active fire numbers dropping fast and Sydney in line for days and days of rain.
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Enzedder
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Enzedder »

This'll do it - simples

Image
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guy smiley
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by guy smiley »

Enzedder wrote:This'll do it - simples
Ahhh.... yeah. Not quite so simple


https://mobile.abc.net.au/news/2020-02- ... ame=iossmf
The Bureau of Meteorology (BOM) issued a severe weather warning extending the length of the coast, with torrential rainfall and damaging winds of up to 90 kilometres per hour expected.

The powerful winds, rain and a king tide are expected to cause erosion along parts of the coast.

Massive waves were seen moving up a cliff face at Kurnell, creating what has been described as a "reverse waterfall".

The State Emergency Services (SES) has responded to more than 2,200 calls since Wednesday, more than 40 of which were for flood rescues.
Just over a week ago we got 120mm overnight at work, in the SA desert. It caused millions worth of infrastructure damage and lost production at just one minesite. The enforced work stoppage for safety reasons next day had us watching a large section of the open pit wall gradually collapse due to concentrated water flow escaping a bunded area above the pit. The rainfall across the east coast currently putting out fires is about to cause a whole new world of hurt and pain.
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usermame
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by usermame »

Oh well, it's not as though climate scientists predicted extremes of weather as the climate changed, there's that to reassure the Liberal and National parties.
grievous
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by grievous »

I haven't seen rain like Sydney is getting since living in Darwin where its the usual and expected. 200mm today plus what we got yesterday, half of today at least.
Flooding everywhere, trees down but most fires through the state are out so there is that.
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Shrekles
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Shrekles »

The Currowan fire near us is now officially out. We have had 200mm this weekend so far and Sod’s law means all furies are now on standby for flood work... no rest for the wicked.
grievous
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by grievous »

Narrabeen residents in northern beaches have been told to evacuate due to rain and king tides, water aint going anywhere but through their homes.
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Pat the Ex Mat
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Pat the Ex Mat »

The Blue Mountains line is cut at Leura due to a landslide.

Tomorrow's commute will be carnage
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kiwigreg369
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by kiwigreg369 »

Great - rain - had flooding at home, multiple trees down, power out in out neighbourhood but not us - but did lose water on Sunday.

More to come.

Yesterday - stupid humidity and top day today .. with more rain for next 7 days. Hope they retain water management focus for a bit longer.
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Shrekles
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Re: Welcome to Hell ... eastern Australia

Post by Shrekles »

A years worth of inflow into water storage already apparently

https://www.smh.com.au/environment/weat ... 53zn0.html
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