Irishers-Official 33rd Dáil Éireann election thread

[CM11]

So we are boggers and mucksavages and yet we elect 2 FF and 1 FG out of 4 seats. The biggest issue I have is that we not only elected a Shinner but a Dub Shinner.

Just spotted that both FF and FG had a marginal increase in their support in your neck of the woods.

It was the Labour and Indo vote that got the Shinner elected.

[camroc1]

Martin really is in a cleft stick.

[Liathroidigloine]

So we are boggers and mucksavages and yet we elect 2 FF and 1 FG out of 4 seats. The biggest issue I have is that we not only elected a Shinner but a Dub Shinner.

Just spotted that both FF and FG had a marginal increase in their support in your neck of the woods.

It was the Labour and Indo vote that got the Shinner elected.

Yep, disappointed that 3000 votes went from the county to the SF scum but we managed to retain most of the votes in county and it'll be enough to get Flaherty elected. Mullingar (sort of) will have three TD's while Athlone has none.

[CM11]

Martin really is in a cleft stick.

He needs to get ahead of the narrative and lay out his red lines about forming a government with anyone (doesn't have to mention SF). The problem is that SFs economic manifesto is full of holes so he couldn't agree to most of it even if he wanted to.

[The Sun God]

Who says people will change their vote when told the facts? People vote with their emotions nowadays rather than their brain.

So you get to their emotions by going through SFs greatest hits.

I accept that trying to convince people that Mary Lou is a snake oil salesman is a big task but they need to be questioned relentlessly on the murders that they have yet to condemn.

The country wouldn't be facing this clusterfcuk today had those questions been asked by our media over the past few weeks. They are as responsible for this shit-show as anyone else.

[Liathroidigloine]

Martin really is in a cleft stick.

He needs to get ahead of the narrative and lay out his red lines about forming a government with anyone (doesn't have to mention SF). The problem is that SFs economic manifesto is full of holes so he couldn't agree to most of it even if he wanted to.

He will do a deal with the devil to be Taoiseach even if it means the end of FF.

[CM11]

Martin really is in a cleft stick.

He needs to get ahead of the narrative and lay out his red lines about forming a government with anyone (doesn't have to mention SF). The problem is that SFs economic manifesto is full of holes so he couldn't agree to most of it even if he wanted to.

He will do a deal with the devil to be Taoiseach even if it means the end of FF.

He's likely to have a longer spell as Taoiseach playing the long game.

[MunsterMan!!!!!]

Martin really is in a cleft stick.

He needs to get ahead of the narrative and lay out his red lines about forming a government with anyone (doesn't have to mention SF). The problem is that SFs economic manifesto is full of holes so he couldn't agree to most of it even if he wanted to.

He will do a deal with the devil to be Taoiseach even if it means the end of FF.

This is the lesser of two evils for me, to be honest. The worst is that they don't agree and another election in 3/4 months time with SF becoming the biggest party.

Stats I agree SF smell blood and will want to go for another election with double the candidates, Martin needs to play this negotiation out in public.

[sewa]

Who says people will change their vote when told the facts? People vote with their emotions nowadays rather than their brain.

So you get to their emotions by going through SFs greatest hits.

I accept that trying to convince people that Mary Lou is a snake oil salesman is a big task but they need to be questioned relentlessly on the murders that they have yet to condemn.

The country wouldn't be facing this clusterfcuk today had those questions been asked by our media over the past few weeks. They are as responsible for this shit-show as anyone else.

Nope, there is no one who hasn't heard those stories. the difference is with the shadow of McGuinness and Gerry gone people have decided the current crew are innocent of anything. Repeating the same old lines will not work with them

[CM11]

Asked yesterday, and after count 7, I'm still thinking the same. Shinner to lose out in Clare despite topping the poll?:

https://www.rte.ie/news/election-2020/r ... onal/clare

All depends where the Green Party votes go, presuming that'll be the candidate that decides it.

[fishfoodie]

Any chance we could stage a military coup? Who'd have the bigger "army"?

You might want to pay your soldiers better than traffic wardens, if you expect them to give a shit about the Politics of the Nation

[CM11]

Martin really is in a cleft stick.

He needs to get ahead of the narrative and lay out his red lines about forming a government with anyone (doesn't have to mention SF). The problem is that SFs economic manifesto is full of holes so he couldn't agree to most of it even if he wanted to.

He will do a deal with the devil to be Taoiseach even if it means the end of FF.

This is the lesser of two evils for me, to be honest. The worst is that they don't agree and another election in 3/4 months time with SF becoming the biggest party.

Stats I agree SF smell blood and will want to go for another election with double the candidates, Martin needs to play this negotiation out in public.

In the short term, what's best for the country might be FF going in with SF. But it's not what's best for FF or the country long term.

[Nolanator]

In my heart of hearts I think I won't be a FF voter or member by the end of the month. If a deal is done I'll vote Fine Gael 1 & 2 and leave it at that.

That's extremely sad

I could see FF TD's splitting now. Those who will sit with SF and those who wont. That would be great for Mary Lou. FF beating FG this time is a real poisoned chalice

How many do you think would be that strong in their convictions?

[Liathroidigloine]

I only realised yesterday that criminals locked up in prison get to vote. How f**ked up is that? Also, convicted murderers should not be eligible for election.

[Liathroidigloine]

Any chance we could stage a military coup? Who'd have the bigger "army"?

You might want to pay your soldiers better than traffic wardens, if you expect them to give a shit about the Politics of the Nation

"The pay for this job is X", "Grand, I'll take it". "Hey, what's going on, my pay is only X?"

[CM11]

In my heart of hearts I think I won't be a FF voter or member by the end of the month. If a deal is done I'll vote Fine Gael 1 & 2 and leave it at that.

That's extremely sad

I could see FF TD's splitting now. Those who will sit with SF and those who wont. That would be great for Mary Lou. FF beating FG this time is a real poisoned chalice

How many do you think would be that strong in their convictions?

No more than FF were seen as FG in this election, if FF go in with SF, it'll solidify the link between the two and SF have the momentum to swallow FF. That will be the biggest question all the FF TDs have to ask themselves. Not 'do I want to go into government with SF' but 'Do I want to join SF' because going in with them starts that process. Really think they'd be mad to do it.

[iarmhiman]

In my heart of hearts I think I won't be a FF voter or member by the end of the month. If a deal is done I'll vote Fine Gael 1 & 2 and leave it at that.

That's extremely sad

I could see FF TD's splitting now. Those who will sit with SF and those who wont. That would be great for Mary Lou. FF beating FG this time is a real poisoned chalice

How many do you think would be that strong in their convictions?

No more than FF were seen as FG in this election, if FF go in with SF, it'll solidify the link between the two and SF have the momentum to swallow FF. That will be the biggest question all the FF TDs have to ask themselves. Not 'do I want to go into government with SF' but 'Do I want to join SF' because going in with them starts that process. Really think they'd be mad to do it.

Does FF going into coalition with FG put the shinners into government next election?

[Nolanator]

In my heart of hearts I think I won't be a FF voter or member by the end of the month. If a deal is done I'll vote Fine Gael 1 & 2 and leave it at that.

That's extremely sad

I could see FF TD's splitting now. Those who will sit with SF and those who wont. That would be great for Mary Lou. FF beating FG this time is a real poisoned chalice

How many do you think would be that strong in their convictions?

No more than FF were seen as FG in this election, if FF go in with SF, it'll solidify the link between the two and SF have the momentum to swallow FF. That will be the biggest question all the FF TDs have to ask themselves. Not 'do I want to go into government with SF' but 'Do I want to join SF' because going in with them starts that process. Really think they'd be mad to do it.

I reckon enough of them would be short termist and selfish enough to do it so they can be in government.

[Mullet 2]

In my heart of hearts I think I won't be a FF voter or member by the end of the month. If a deal is done I'll vote Fine Gael 1 & 2 and leave it at that.

That's extremely sad

I could see FF TD's splitting now. Those who will sit with SF and those who wont. That would be great for Mary Lou. FF beating FG this time is a real poisoned chalice

I'm already at loggerheads with very old friends.

But I'm not letting anybody simply pretend this isn't a front for the Army Council because it's convenient

[CM11]

In my heart of hearts I think I won't be a FF voter or member by the end of the month. If a deal is done I'll vote Fine Gael 1 & 2 and leave it at that.

That's extremely sad

I could see FF TD's splitting now. Those who will sit with SF and those who wont. That would be great for Mary Lou. FF beating FG this time is a real poisoned chalice

How many do you think would be that strong in their convictions?

No more than FF were seen as FG in this election, if FF go in with SF, it'll solidify the link between the two and SF have the momentum to swallow FF. That will be the biggest question all the FF TDs have to ask themselves. Not 'do I want to go into government with SF' but 'Do I want to join SF' because going in with them starts that process. Really think they'd be mad to do it.

Does FF going into coalition with FG put the shinners into government next election?

I don't actually think it does. Although a lot would have to go right, starting with no recession.

Well over half the country still voted for centre TDs, I don't think they'll all flock to SF but it makes the decision much harder if they want to punish FF/FG.

It's a right pickle.

[MunsterMan!!!!!]

Martin really is in a cleft stick.

He needs to get ahead of the narrative and lay out his red lines about forming a government with anyone (doesn't have to mention SF). The problem is that SFs economic manifesto is full of holes so he couldn't agree to most of it even if he wanted to.

He will do a deal with the devil to be Taoiseach even if it means the end of FF.

This is the lesser of two evils for me, to be honest. The worst is that they don't agree and another election in 3/4 months time with SF becoming the biggest party.

Stats I agree SF smell blood and will want to go for another election with double the candidates, Martin needs to play this negotiation out in public.

In the short term, what's best for the country might be FF going in with SF. But it's not what's best for FF or the country long term.

What do you think is best for the country long term?

[camroc1]

In my heart of hearts I think I won't be a FF voter or member by the end of the month. If a deal is done I'll vote Fine Gael 1 & 2 and leave it at that.

That's extremely sad

I could see FF TD's splitting now. Those who will sit with SF and those who wont. That would be great for Mary Lou. FF beating FG this time is a real poisoned chalice

How many do you think would be that strong in their convictions?

No more than FF were seen as FG in this election, if FF go in with SF, it'll solidify the link between the two and SF have the momentum to swallow FF. That will be the biggest question all the FF TDs have to ask themselves. Not 'do I want to go into government with SF' but 'Do I want to join SF' because going in with them starts that process. Really think they'd be mad to do it.

Does FF going into coalition with FG put the shinners into government next election?

A number of things will change before the next election whether that's in three months or three years,

The first is that SF will be seen as a potential government party and it's policies and spokes persons will come under considerable media gaze, analysis and criticism.
Secondly, SF have reaped the benefit of a general anti-establishment feeling, and keeping that additional 10% or so of their vote will be difficult when they are striving to become the establishment themselves.
Thirdly, as I noted previously, making the jump from one TD per constituency to two, is actually quite a difficult trick to pull off.
And finally, the full glare of FF and FG will be brought to bear on SF, and a goodly proportion of the lumps they normally knock out of each other will now be aimed at SF.

[CM11]

What do you think is best for the country long term?

Discover time travel?

I honestly don't know. I think we've fractured into black and white unfortunately so FF and FG joining forces might be the only solution. It looks like the terrorist aspect of SF has being brushed under the carpet and they're now seen as a legit party. It's a mess because I think tradidtionally the combination of either FG and Labour or FF, either on their own or with a few extras, worked because there was enough crossover across society with those matchups. My worry now is that it's become an us against them situation, like the UK and US and it's not going to end well.

But if FF join forces with SF then that really splinters the centre and that would be my worst case scenario, time to sell up and move somewhere warm.

[Liathroidigloine]

Martin really is in a cleft stick.

He needs to get ahead of the narrative and lay out his red lines about forming a government with anyone (doesn't have to mention SF). The problem is that SFs economic manifesto is full of holes so he couldn't agree to most of it even if he wanted to.

He will do a deal with the devil to be Taoiseach even if it means the end of FF.

This is the lesser of two evils for me, to be honest. The worst is that they don't agree and another election in 3/4 months time with SF becoming the biggest party.

Stats I agree SF smell blood and will want to go for another election with double the candidates, Martin needs to play this negotiation out in public.

In the short term, what's best for the country might be FF going in with SF. But it's not what's best for FF or the country long term.

You missed where I pointed out that people don't vote with their brains anymore. It's all emotion, tweets and meme's. SF have the machine to control that so forget political analysis.

What do you think is best for the country long term?[/quote]

[Gavin Duffy]

Good article here from Colm McCarthy https://www.independent.ie/opinion/comm ... 38736.html

[themaddog]

In my heart of hearts I think I won't be a FF voter or member by the end of the month. If a deal is done I'll vote Fine Gael 1 & 2 and leave it at that.

That's extremely sad

I could see FF TD's splitting now. Those who will sit with SF and those who wont. That would be great for Mary Lou. FF beating FG this time is a real poisoned chalice

I'm already at loggerheads with very old friends.

But I'm not letting anybody simply pretend this isn't a front for the Army Council because it's convenient

I hope there are enough of similar mindset. Just look at the SDLP for suitable comparisons.

[CM11]

Good article here from Colm McCarthy https://www.independent.ie/opinion/comm ... 38736.html

Election candidates promise new railway lines to places from which nobody would choose to commute if a coherent land-use policy was in place and land prices reduced. Every derelict side in the city and every deserted wilderness on the outskirts is defended against development by an unholy alliance of residents' associations and hypocritical politicians, who champion affordability but obstruct policies to bring it about.

The housing crisis summed up in a nutshell. Well, a big part of the problem.

[normilet]

It's all emotion, tweets and meme's. SF have the machine to control that so forget political analysis.

What do you think is best for the country long term?

I was attempting to have a debate with some otherwise sane people who would be anti-FF/FG and voted SF.

All I got back were memes, photoshopped pictures of Coveney leading Varadkar in a gimp suit, and the most mind blowingly inaccurate statistics: "100,000 homeless people in Dublin alone, 20,000 people on trollies, no bankers pay any tax since the bailout" etc.

They also literally do not give a toss about the past when its specific to SF, but happy to bitch about FF and FG facilitating church abuse, Tuam baby thing etc. It's not even selective amnesia, they know full well what happened, they just don't care.

You just can't win against that. Or at least, I don't see how you can win against that currently.

[CM11]

It's all emotion, tweets and meme's. SF have the machine to control that so forget political analysis.

What do you think is best for the country long term?

I was attempting to have a debate with some otherwise sane people who would be anti-FF/FG and voted SF.

All I got back were memes, photoshopped pictures of Coveney leading Varadkar in a gimp suit, and the most mind blowingly inaccurate statistics: "100,000 homeless people in Dublin alone, 20,000 people on trollies, no bankers pay any tax since the bailout" etc.

They also literally do not give a toss about the past when its specific to SF, but happy to bitch about FF and FG facilitating church abuse, Tuam baby thing etc. It's not even selective amnesia, they know full well what happened, they just don't care.

You just can't win against that. Or at least, I don't see how you can win against that currently.

It's a bit like kids wanting to do their own thing, make their own mistakes. You just can't fight that type of stuff as it just leads to more entrenchment.

Have they always been anti FF/FG? If so, not really the type of people who need to be argued with at all. They're a lost cause.

[MunsterMan!!!!!]

What do you think is best for the country long term?

Discover time travel?

I honestly don't know. I think we've fractured into black and white unfortunately so FF and FG joining forces might be the only solution. It looks like the terrorist aspect of SF has being brushed under the carpet and they're now seen as a legit party. It's a mess because I think tradidtionally the combination of either FG and Labour or FF, either on their own or with a few extras, worked because there was enough crossover across society with those matchups. My worry now is that it's become an us against them situation, like the UK and US and it's not going to end well.

But if FF join forces with SF then that really splinters the centre and that would be my worst case scenario, time to sell up and move somewhere warm.

I think they need to go into government with FF ensuring damage control, they need to disappoint some of their voters, esp the floating voters. It is this or they are a big party in the coming years, that is the unthinkable for me.

[CM11]

According to checktheregister.ie I was registered in my current and my previous two addresses. I know I received at least one polling card at one of those previous addresses as well as the one I used to vote. So how do they count the turn-out? Because since I only voted once it seems like my own personal turn-out was 33% which I’m very disappointed in. Hope to do better next time.

Saw this elsewhere, gave a wry chuckle.

Could this person have voted 3 times without being easily caught? Or does your ID have to have your address on it?

Not suggesting any conspiracy, btw, just seems the register is being maintained shoddily.

[Boxcar Ira]

It's all emotion, tweets and meme's. SF have the machine to control that so forget political analysis.

What do you think is best for the country long term?

I was attempting to have a debate with some otherwise sane people who would be anti-FF/FG and voted SF.

All I got back were memes, photoshopped pictures of Coveney leading Varadkar in a gimp suit, and the most mind blowingly inaccurate statistics: "100,000 homeless people in Dublin alone, 20,000 people on trollies, no bankers pay any tax since the bailout" etc.

They also literally do not give a toss about the past when its specific to SF, but happy to bitch about FF and FG facilitating church abuse, Tuam baby thing etc. It's not even selective amnesia, they know full well what happened, they just don't care.

You just can't win against that. Or at least, I don't see how you can win against that currently.

It's a bit like kids wanting to do their own thing, make their own mistakes. You just can't fight that type of stuff as it just leads to more entrenchment.

Have they always been anti FF/FG? If so, not really the type of people who need to be argued with at all. They're a lost cause.

Yeah the worst thing you can start doing is calling people stupid and ill-informed. They just double down as we've seen in Brexit Land and Trump Land. Everyone is a genius in their own head (me included).

Just have to get informed yourself and beat them with facts.

[CM11]

What do you think is best for the country long term?

Discover time travel?

I honestly don't know. I think we've fractured into black and white unfortunately so FF and FG joining forces might be the only solution. It looks like the terrorist aspect of SF has being brushed under the carpet and they're now seen as a legit party. It's a mess because I think tradidtionally the combination of either FG and Labour or FF, either on their own or with a few extras, worked because there was enough crossover across society with those matchups. My worry now is that it's become an us against them situation, like the UK and US and it's not going to end well.

But if FF join forces with SF then that really splinters the centre and that would be my worst case scenario, time to sell up and move somewhere warm.

I think they need to go into government with FF ensuring damage control, they need to disappoint some of their voters, esp the floating voters. It is this or they are a big party in the coming years, that is the unthinkable for me.

I think they become a bigger party if they go in with FF. I could even see some FF TDs defecting to SF before the next election if they were in government together.

[Floppykid]

The worst on twitter are the smug, preening woke types whose timelines are filled with social justice shite of the day.
The want to tell people the right/correct way to feel about Sinn Fein/the provos and equivocate their grizzly past.

Full of shit, total hypocrites.

[Boxcar Ira]

I think they become a bigger party if they go in with FF. I could even see some FF TDs defecting to SF before the next election if they were in government together.

This is inevitable.

[MunsterMan!!!!!]

You missed where I pointed out that people don't vote with their brains anymore. It's all emotion, tweets and meme's. SF have the machine to control that so forget political analysis.

oh I agree, SF are so far ahead in the online narrative it is scary, both FF and FG will be playing catch-up for the next few years. Politics is now brand warfare and optics, even more so that before, policies and truths aren't that important.

[Floppykid]

You missed where I pointed out that people don't vote with their brains anymore. It's all emotion, tweets and meme's. SF have the machine to control that so forget political analysis.

oh I agree, SF are so far ahead in the online narrative it is scary, both FF and FG will be playing catch-up for the next few years. Politics is now brand warfare and optics, even more so that before, policies and truths aren't that important.

It's become much more about spiting and punishing your opponents too.
It's not enough to win, the opposition are irredeemable and borderline evil.

[The Sun God]

So Kate O'Connell fails to be re-elected..!! I guess there are consequences when wealthy politicians attempt stunts to get media attention.

[Mullet 2]

So Kate O'Connell fails to be re-elected..!! I guess there are consequences when wealthy politicians attempt stunts to get media attention.

Another great liberal lion joins the scrap heap

[Blackrock Bullet]

In my heart of hearts I think I won't be a FF voter or member by the end of the month. If a deal is done I'll vote Fine Gael 1 & 2 and leave it at that.

That's extremely sad

I could see FF TD's splitting now. Those who will sit with SF and those who wont. That would be great for Mary Lou. FF beating FG this time is a real poisoned chalice

How many do you think would be that strong in their convictions?

No more than FF were seen as FG in this election, if FF go in with SF, it'll solidify the link between the two and SF have the momentum to swallow FF. That will be the biggest question all the FF TDs have to ask themselves. Not 'do I want to go into government with SF' but 'Do I want to join SF' because going in with them starts that process. Really think they'd be mad to do it.

SF only swallow FF if the election is in the next year and they can walk out over some ridiculous promise.

Otherwise SF will "betray" most of their base.

That's why we sadly need a line up of the same high profile non SF lefty people in the Dáil.