Planet Rugby Forum

Sandstorm wrote:

croyals wrote: We're going to need some sort of national fitness strategy after this.

I don’t see many fatties exercising around the neighbourhood and we’re being forced to spend 23 hours a day inside. Good luck.

bobbity wrote:

Slightly straying in to my areas of interest/expertise here. I have plenty of clients who train regularly and care about their fitness, but can or will not reduce their calorie intake. From all sources, drink being a big thing.

I expect that lots of things will be studied in those most severely affected, but more granular than just obesity I wonder about the impact of alcohol intake here.

The country needs to have a grown up conversation about alcohol and obesity. Instead we've had a laugh and a joke about daytime drinking.

dpedin wrote:We are getting into interesting issues here. I wouldn't be too unhappy to have a more informed public health input into a range of policies way before thinking about national service. Increased tax on smoking, minimum alcohol pricing, sugar tax, banning advertising for unhealthy foods, particularly to kids, reducing exhaust emissions, daily mile in school and in workplaces, progressive healthcare policies on treatment of obesity, subsidised cost of gyms, cycle routes in cities, etc etc. I wonder how long it would be before the nanny state guys are jumping up and down in a red faced gammony apoplectic rage? Surely leaving it to 'common sense' and market forces is the way ahead?

DragsterDriver wrote:Common sense is a myth. We need nanny state in this country, start with culling shit food from supermarkets and reduce takeaway numbers, and improve what’s on offer.

dpedin wrote:

DragsterDriver wrote:Common sense is a myth. We need nanny state in this country, start with culling shit food from supermarkets and reduce takeaway numbers, and improve what’s on offer.

Dont disagree. I go on golfing trips to France and to the US, South Carolina.

croyals wrote:There will be an outcry but I actually think this is the time to give it a proper crack - people who would otherwise be up in arms about KFC going up in price are scared shitless about the virus so may listen.

Nolanator wrote:

croyals wrote:There will be an outcry but I actually think this is the time to give it a proper crack - people who would otherwise be up in arms about KFC going up in price are scared shitless about the virus so may listen.

If ever there's a time to capitalise on the fear/awareness of the health implications of being fat, now is the time. Hammer home the message that being obese is extremely problematic for your health and can literally kill you in weeks if you catch the wrong thing.
Surely there's a way to harmess the performative "support the NHS" bullshit that's going on as well? Want to support the heroes in the NHS? Reduce the chances that you'll need to visit them by not being fat. Mind you, plenty of people clapping on Thursday a couple of weeks ago were out the following day having street parties, so I don't think that avenue will see much success.

croyals wrote:

dpedin wrote:We are getting into interesting issues here. I wouldn't be too unhappy to have a more informed public health input into a range of policies way before thinking about national service. Increased tax on smoking, minimum alcohol pricing, sugar tax, banning advertising for unhealthy foods, particularly to kids, reducing exhaust emissions, daily mile in school and in workplaces, progressive healthcare policies on treatment of obesity, subsidised cost of gyms, cycle routes in cities, etc etc. I wonder how long it would be before the nanny state guys are jumping up and down in a red faced gammony apoplectic rage? Surely leaving it to 'common sense' and market forces is the way ahead?

Its a really interesting topic and the benefits of us being less heavy and healthier aren't just corona related. I'm thinking for the NHS generally both on a physical and mental level and for the general environment - the cleaner air during this lockdown has been a great side effect, hopefully more people will walk/cycle where they previously drove.

There will be an outcry but I actually think this is the time to give it a proper crack - people who would otherwise be up in arms about KFC going up in price are scared shitless about the virus so may listen.

shaggy wrote:

croyals wrote:

dpedin wrote:We are getting into interesting issues here. I wouldn't be too unhappy to have a more informed public health input into a range of policies way before thinking about national service. Increased tax on smoking, minimum alcohol pricing, sugar tax, banning advertising for unhealthy foods, particularly to kids, reducing exhaust emissions, daily mile in school and in workplaces, progressive healthcare policies on treatment of obesity, subsidised cost of gyms, cycle routes in cities, etc etc. I wonder how long it would be before the nanny state guys are jumping up and down in a red faced gammony apoplectic rage? Surely leaving it to 'common sense' and market forces is the way ahead?

Its a really interesting topic and the benefits of us being less heavy and healthier aren't just corona related. I'm thinking for the NHS generally both on a physical and mental level and for the general environment - the cleaner air during this lockdown has been a great side effect, hopefully more people will walk/cycle where they previously drove.

There will be an outcry but I actually think this is the time to give it a proper crack - people who would otherwise be up in arms about KFC going up in price are scared shitless about the virus so may listen.

Nice idea on the cycling but went for a 2 hour ride Saturday afternoon and the roads were full of poor cyclists and many highly dangerous motorists who have been enjoying the empty roads with a heavier right foot than normal.

I saw a number of incidents between the two and got side swiped by some twat towing a horse box very badly - first real incident I have had in nearly 12 years.

We are going to see a lot more traffic incidents now as the country starts up and any move to more cycling will have mixed results unless there is massive infrastructure changes.

croyals wrote:

Nolanator wrote:

croyals wrote:There will be an outcry but I actually think this is the time to give it a proper crack - people who would otherwise be up in arms about KFC going up in price are scared shitless about the virus so may listen.

If ever there's a time to capitalise on the fear/awareness of the health implications of being fat, now is the time. Hammer home the message that being obese is extremely problematic for your health and can literally kill you in weeks if you catch the wrong thing.
Surely there's a way to harmess the performative "support the NHS" bullshit that's going on as well? Want to support the heroes in the NHS? Reduce the chances that you'll need to visit them by not being fat. Mind you, plenty of people clapping on Thursday a couple of weeks ago were out the following day having street parties, so I don't think that avenue will see much success.

I fully agree. If we don't do it now we never will. For almost everyone a BMI of under 30 is very achievable and we'd see a huge benefit from it. And christ we've got to treat letting your kids get obese as a form of child abuse.

I don't think it needs to be crazily radical either - move a bit more, eat a bit less, still have something trashy once or twice a week. It is achievable if we decide as a country we want to do it.

bimboman wrote:Nols, I completely agree. And when Odave was posting he did details of a study him and another health guy in London had done, pretty much proving giving personal trainers to younger type 2 diabetics was cheaper than the current methods of treatment and medications.


Diabetics make up 25% of the deaths from covid in England.

Nolanator wrote:
Fat acceptance really bothers me, as well. I'm not saying that people should be put in (large) stockades and publicly ridiculed, but this shit of letting people be who they are is bollocks. It shouldn't be socially acceptable to be obese.

bimboman wrote:Nols, I completely agree. And when Odave was posting he did details of a study him and another health guy in London had done, pretty much proving giving personal trainers to younger type 2 diabetics was cheaper than the current methods of treatment and medications.

croyals wrote:

Nolanator wrote:
Fat acceptance really bothers me, as well. I'm not saying that people should be put in (large) stockades and publicly ridiculed, but this shit of letting people be who they are is bollocks. It shouldn't be socially acceptable to be obese.

There's two strands to this:
1) Your life choice negatively affects the NHS (particularly powerful atm I would guess)
2) Society will support you as you change your lifestyle

After this crisis we, along with much of the West are going to be poorer and allocating scarce resources. I suspect the time of individualism and a focus on instant gratification has come to an end.

Nolanator wrote: It'll be hard to get that through the Twitterati hoardes.

croyals wrote:

shaggy wrote:

croyals wrote:

dpedin wrote:We are getting into interesting issues here. I wouldn't be too unhappy to have a more informed public health input into a range of policies way before thinking about national service. Increased tax on smoking, minimum alcohol pricing, sugar tax, banning advertising for unhealthy foods, particularly to kids, reducing exhaust emissions, daily mile in school and in workplaces, progressive healthcare policies on treatment of obesity, subsidised cost of gyms, cycle routes in cities, etc etc. I wonder how long it would be before the nanny state guys are jumping up and down in a red faced gammony apoplectic rage? Surely leaving it to 'common sense' and market forces is the way ahead?

Its a really interesting topic and the benefits of us being less heavy and healthier aren't just corona related. I'm thinking for the NHS generally both on a physical and mental level and for the general environment - the cleaner air during this lockdown has been a great side effect, hopefully more people will walk/cycle where they previously drove.

There will be an outcry but I actually think this is the time to give it a proper crack - people who would otherwise be up in arms about KFC going up in price are scared shitless about the virus so may listen.

Nice idea on the cycling but went for a 2 hour ride Saturday afternoon and the roads were full of poor cyclists and many highly dangerous motorists who have been enjoying the empty roads with a heavier right foot than normal.

I saw a number of incidents between the two and got side swiped by some twat towing a horse box very badly - first real incident I have had in nearly 12 years.

We are going to see a lot more traffic incidents now as the country starts up and any move to more cycling will have mixed results unless there is massive infrastructure changes.

The government has promised £2bn for new cycling infrastructure which is not before time. I love cycling and do it on holiday but have little interest in being run off the road by some twat in a Mondeo.

So I agree, if we want more people to cycle (and I think it is a necessity given that trains and buses will be no go zones for most for years) then we need:
1) more properly segregated infrastructure, not just a white line on a main road
2) drivers to calm down and behave better around cyclists
3) free cycling education available

Nolanator wrote:

bimboman wrote:Nols, I completely agree. And when Odave was posting he did details of a study him and another health guy in London had done, pretty much proving giving personal trainers to younger type 2 diabetics was cheaper than the current methods of treatment and medications.

That sounds to me like behavioural changes (which is what a decent PT will do) in diabetics are much better than medical changes.

Treating it primarily as a lifestyle issue, rather than a medical one (although obviously without dismissing the medical part entirely), has much greater benefit to the person. This is your anecdotal experience too, isn't it?

ukjim wrote:You cant outrun a bad diet. Especially with T2DM:
for every 150 kcal from sugar there is a 11 fold increase in T2DM vs 150 from fat and protein weight or activity levels didn't affect it.
Carbohydrate restriction is effective to treat T2DM
Regular exercise has a whole host of health benefits but weight loss is not one of them

Lobby wrote:

Lemoentjie wrote:https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/coronavi ... r-BB14aNOg

Wow, looks like the UK locked down upon poor advice. Why is there no strong public debate about the lockdown? Where is the SA model?

The main reason why it’s only anti-vaxxers ands loons like Fat Albert who argue there shouldn’t have been a lockdown, is that with 33,000+ deaths and counting, arguing that things would have been better if only we’d had lots more deaths is a hard sell at the moment.

Lemoentjie wrote:

Lobby wrote:

Lemoentjie wrote:https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/coronavi ... r-BB14aNOg

Wow, looks like the UK locked down upon poor advice. Why is there no strong public debate about the lockdown? Where is the SA model?

The main reason why it’s only anti-vaxxers ands loons like Fat Albert who argue there shouldn’t have been a lockdown, is that with 33,000+ deaths and counting, arguing that things would have been better if only we’d had lots more deaths is a hard sell at the moment.

FFS. You're thinking short term. Ignoring long term factors such as immunity and economic effects, as well as other health conditions, physical and mental. And in Africa we cannot afford infinite lockdown as Europe.

Lemoentjie wrote:

Lobby wrote:

Lemoentjie wrote:https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/coronavi ... r-BB14aNOg

Wow, looks like the UK locked down upon poor advice. Why is there no strong public debate about the lockdown? Where is the SA model?

The main reason why it’s only anti-vaxxers ands loons like Fat Albert who argue there shouldn’t have been a lockdown, is that with 33,000+ deaths and counting, arguing that things would have been better if only we’d had lots more deaths is a hard sell at the moment.

FFS. You're thinking short term. Ignoring long term factors such as immunity and economic effects, as well as other health conditions, physical and mental. And in Africa we cannot afford infinite lockdown as Europe.

Blackrock Bullet wrote:Their public health care experts disagree with you.

bimboman wrote:

Nolanator wrote:

bimboman wrote:Nols, I completely agree. And when Odave was posting he did details of a study him and another health guy in London had done, pretty much proving giving personal trainers to younger type 2 diabetics was cheaper than the current methods of treatment and medications.

That sounds to me like behavioural changes (which is what a decent PT will do) in diabetics are much better than medical changes.

Treating it primarily as a lifestyle issue, rather than a medical one (although obviously without dismissing the medical part entirely), has much greater benefit to the person. This is your anecdotal experience too, isn't it?

Well yes it was behaviour change, they did the study on 2 sessions a week including transport to and from the gym (London based, so proximity was quite close and cheap). odave was very qualified and the study went through peer review.

Mine yes, dropped 10% of weight in 3 months (hard). Dropped another 10% in the next three months (easy). Have until lockdown lifted weights every week for over 10 years. Diet pretty normal now, low (ish) carbohydrates, healthy choices (whole meal breads, rice, no or very small pasta dishes. Sugars normal as measured 6 monthly for 10 years.

Short Man Syndrome wrote:

bimboman wrote:

Nolanator wrote:

bimboman wrote:Nols, I completely agree. And when Odave was posting he did details of a study him and another health guy in London had done, pretty much proving giving personal trainers to younger type 2 diabetics was cheaper than the current methods of treatment and medications.

That sounds to me like behavioural changes (which is what a decent PT will do) in diabetics are much better than medical changes.

Treating it primarily as a lifestyle issue, rather than a medical one (although obviously without dismissing the medical part entirely), has much greater benefit to the person. This is your anecdotal experience too, isn't it?

Well yes it was behaviour change, they did the study on 2 sessions a week including transport to and from the gym (London based, so proximity was quite close and cheap). odave was very qualified and the study went through peer review.

Mine yes, dropped 10% of weight in 3 months (hard). Dropped another 10% in the next three months (easy). Have until lockdown lifted weights every week for over 10 years. Diet pretty normal now, low (ish) carbohydrates, healthy choices (whole meal breads, rice, no or very small pasta dishes. Sugars normal as measured 6 monthly for 10 years.

Great work

My gf has just started making me join her in daily work-outs... am right in the middle of the 'haven't done any exercise for a few months' pain and soreness. Why she won't just let me descend into fat old bastardness is anyone's guess.

Lorthern Nights wrote:What has been the longest lockdown a country has had before it started loosening even the smallest of measures?

Sturgeon now saying that she wont let up until at least 28th May, am i wrong or would this make us the longest lockdown, I know some countries have been stricter in terms of the lockdown(kids not outside etc) but would this make it the longest with no let up?

It's f**king depressing we have another 10 day so this shit, f**king police state.

ChipSpike wrote:

Lorthern Nights wrote:What has been the longest lockdown a country has had before it started loosening even the smallest of measures?

Sturgeon now saying that she wont let up until at least 28th May, am i wrong or would this make us the longest lockdown, I know some countries have been stricter in terms of the lockdown(kids not outside etc) but would this make it the longest with no let up?

It's f**king depressing we have another 10 day so this shit, f**king police state.

Same here in Wales, FM today was considering whether to increase covid fines, never mind actually putting dates on loosening measures.

Lorthern Nights wrote:

ChipSpike wrote:

Lorthern Nights wrote:What has been the longest lockdown a country has had before it started loosening even the smallest of measures?

Sturgeon now saying that she wont let up until at least 28th May, am i wrong or would this make us the longest lockdown, I know some countries have been stricter in terms of the lockdown(kids not outside etc) but would this make it the longest with no let up?

It's f**king depressing we have another 10 day so this shit, f**king police state.

Same here in Wales, FM today was considering whether to increase covid fines, never mind actually putting dates on loosening measures.

You can still at least play golf in Wales though cant you?

Lorthern Nights wrote:

ChipSpike wrote:

Lorthern Nights wrote:What has been the longest lockdown a country has had before it started loosening even the smallest of measures?

Sturgeon now saying that she wont let up until at least 28th May, am i wrong or would this make us the longest lockdown, I know some countries have been stricter in terms of the lockdown(kids not outside etc) but would this make it the longest with no let up?

It's f**king depressing we have another 10 day so this shit, f**king police state.

Same here in Wales, FM today was considering whether to increase covid fines, never mind actually putting dates on loosening measures.

You can still at least play golf in Wales though cant you?

bimboman wrote:

Short Man Syndrome wrote:

bimboman wrote:

Nolanator wrote:

bimboman wrote:Nols, I completely agree. And when Odave was posting he did details of a study him and another health guy in London had done, pretty much proving giving personal trainers to younger type 2 diabetics was cheaper than the current methods of treatment and medications.

That sounds to me like behavioural changes (which is what a decent PT will do) in diabetics are much better than medical changes.

Treating it primarily as a lifestyle issue, rather than a medical one (although obviously without dismissing the medical part entirely), has much greater benefit to the person. This is your anecdotal experience too, isn't it?

Well yes it was behaviour change, they did the study on 2 sessions a week including transport to and from the gym (London based, so proximity was quite close and cheap). odave was very qualified and the study went through peer review.

Mine yes, dropped 10% of weight in 3 months (hard). Dropped another 10% in the next three months (easy). Have until lockdown lifted weights every week for over 10 years. Diet pretty normal now, low (ish) carbohydrates, healthy choices (whole meal breads, rice, no or very small pasta dishes. Sugars normal as measured 6 monthly for 10 years.

Great work

My gf has just started making me join her in daily work-outs... am right in the middle of the 'haven't done any exercise for a few months' pain and soreness. Why she won't just let me descend into fat old bastardness is anyone's guess.

If you’re still in the States then dieting is ganna be tougher than anything.

Yeah, a little. We've disciplined ourselves to one cheat day a week - usually a cheeseburger + fries or donuts. But the fresh produce is superb, massive bowls of fruit and plenty of veg... I think I'm at my optimum fighting weight of 92kg, I'm definitely at that stage where I'm not going to shift the last bit of flab without some serious dedication and application, and I just don't have it. I'll stick with my four-pack.

Saint wrote:

Lorthern Nights wrote:

ChipSpike wrote:

Lorthern Nights wrote:What has been the longest lockdown a country has had before it started loosening even the smallest of measures?

Sturgeon now saying that she wont let up until at least 28th May, am i wrong or would this make us the longest lockdown, I know some countries have been stricter in terms of the lockdown(kids not outside etc) but would this make it the longest with no let up?

It's f**king depressing we have another 10 day so this shit, f**king police state.

Same here in Wales, FM today was considering whether to increase covid fines, never mind actually putting dates on loosening measures.

You can still at least play golf in Wales though cant you?

Isn;t the issue that in Scotland and Wales the R is either approaching or beyond 1 at the moment?

Saint wrote:

Lorthern Nights wrote:

ChipSpike wrote:

Lorthern Nights wrote:What has been the longest lockdown a country has had before it started loosening even the smallest of measures?

Sturgeon now saying that she wont let up until at least 28th May, am i wrong or would this make us the longest lockdown, I know some countries have been stricter in terms of the lockdown(kids not outside etc) but would this make it the longest with no let up?

It's f**king depressing we have another 10 day so this shit, f**king police state.

Same here in Wales, FM today was considering whether to increase covid fines, never mind actually putting dates on loosening measures.

You can still at least play golf in Wales though cant you?

Isn;t the issue that in Scotland and Wales the R is either approaching or beyond 1 at the moment?

message #2527204 wrote:

Clogs wrote:

ovalball wrote:

camroc1 wrote:In countries that did lock down, the difference in death rates would appear to be down to whether or not the virus got into care/retirement homes and the like. And that could have been down to different systems, or just pure dumb luck.

Quite a few PhD's will give us the answer in due course.

The most successful appear to be those that have experience in dealing with this sort of thing - acting quickly, comprehensively, and keeping infection numbers low enough to track and trace thoroughly.

On the surface it would appear so. But keeping infection numbers low is not an indefinite state. Just one asymptomatic person in any country that is emerging from lockdown can seed this thing and off we go again. My concern in Melbourne at the moment is that we are seeing cases emerge at a time when we thought we were over the worst of it. If that meatworks person had not injured themselves and ended up in emergency, he would not have been tested and the 90 odd other cases that have now been linked to that would not have been found. And all of them would have been seeding and spreading.

In the UK it is estimated that there are currently 150 000 people infected. They haven't been tested. So what happens after lock down? I think this thing, like any influenza will slowly run its course and get very close to halting once about 20-25% of the population have had it. Or if we get lucky and a vaccine is found in the next 4 weeks.

If R is kept below 1, then that number will decrease.

happyhooker wrote:I see matt Hancock is now saying that the app will be ready in the coming weeks rather than the mid may originally promised.

Well colour me surprised

Professor Karol Sikora has become something of a celebrity in the UK over the past months for his expert commentary on the pandemic.

We had a wide-ranging discussion, in which he said:

The virus is ‘getting tired’
– In the past two weeks, the virus is showing signs of petering out
– It’s as though the virus is ‘getting tired’
– It’s happening across the world at the same time

There is existing herd immunity
– The serology results around the world (and forthcoming in Britain) don’t necessarily reveal the percentage of people who have had the disease
– He estimates 25-30% of the UK population has had Covid-19, and higher in the group that is most susceptible
– Pockets of herd immunity help *already* explain the downturn
– Sweden’s end result will not be different to ours – lockdown versus no lockdown

Fear is more deadly than the virus
– When the history books are written, the fear will have done much more damage than the virus, including large numbers of cancer and cardiological patients not being treated and dying unneccessarily
– We should have got the machinery of the NHS for non-corona patients back open earlier

Masks and schools
– Evidence on masks is just not there either way so it should be an ‘individual decision’
– We should move to 1m social distancing which means restaurants and bars could reopen
– More schools should reopen in June as ‘children are not the transmitters of this virus’
– We should be getting back to the ‘old normal’ not a ‘new normal’

eldanielfire wrote:

happyhooker wrote:I see matt Hancock is now saying that the app will be ready in the coming weeks rather than the mid may originally promised.

Well colour me surprised

Why not sure the apps already used in other countries?