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PostPosted: Sat May 23, 2020 8:39 pm 
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Brazil, Russia and Mexico appear to be spiraling out of control.


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PostPosted: Sat May 23, 2020 9:54 pm 
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A pretty shocking look at tijuana https://www.latimes.com/california/stor ... in-tijuana


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PostPosted: Sat May 23, 2020 10:11 pm 
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Gavin Duffy wrote:
Brazil, Russia and Mexico appear to be spiraling out of control.


Apparently the Colombian health system, fragile enough already, is close to collapse. My family in law were saying they're trying to ease some restrictions to stave off serious unrest but doesn't sound good, even though their numbers look relatively good. They were locking people up who broke quarantine etc.

Venezuela has extended their lockdown, but seems patchily enforced since my (future) FiL seems to be going to work and visiting relatives and hospitals. They're claiming victory over covid-19, which I would not believe at all.


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 3:03 am 
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The situation in Peru is dire too...


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 7:54 am 
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Bullettyme wrote:
Gavin Duffy wrote:
Brazil, Russia and Mexico appear to be spiraling out of control.


Apparently the Colombian health system, fragile enough already, is close to collapse. My family in law were saying they're trying to ease some restrictions to stave off serious unrest but doesn't sound good, even though their numbers look relatively good. They were locking people up who broke quarantine etc.

Venezuela has extended their lockdown, but seems patchily enforced since my (future) FiL seems to be going to work and visiting relatives and hospitals. They're claiming victory over covid-19, which I would not believe at all.


I have friends and the Wife’s family in Colombia saying that there is only 400 or so deaths? In a country of close to 50 million that’s a decent return.
Plus they are still in lockdown (men and women are allowed outside for 30 minutes on alternate days) until the end of June.
Colombians (jungle-dwelling narco terrorists aside) tend to be quite respectful of rules (excluding when it comes to driving) and authority so a harsh lockdown should be effective.
Bogota’s airport is closed for the next few months, plus Avianca (national carrier) applied for bankruptcy protection last week so there won’t be much in the way of people coming in and out of the country for a while.


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 10:42 am 
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See Spain are now opening up to furriners from July. Might get away for August after all if we don't have to quarantine on return :o


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 2:25 pm 
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Do Sweden have a weekend dip normally? Good figures from them yesterday and today if not.


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 2:30 pm 
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CM11 wrote:
Do Sweden have a weekend dip normally? Good figures from them yesterday and today if not.


You would expect a dip as they have been tackling their nursing home debacle


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 2:33 pm 
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CM11 wrote:
Do Sweden have a weekend dip normally? Good figures from them yesterday and today if not.

Looks like a consistent pattern, no obvious change from the last few weeks - slightly worse than a week ago if anything.


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 3:08 pm 
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Jim Lahey wrote:
Bullettyme wrote:
Gavin Duffy wrote:
Brazil, Russia and Mexico appear to be spiraling out of control.


Apparently the Colombian health system, fragile enough already, is close to collapse. My family in law were saying they're trying to ease some restrictions to stave off serious unrest but doesn't sound good, even though their numbers look relatively good. They were locking people up who broke quarantine etc.

Venezuela has extended their lockdown, but seems patchily enforced since my (future) FiL seems to be going to work and visiting relatives and hospitals. They're claiming victory over covid-19, which I would not believe at all.


I have friends and the Wife’s family in Colombia saying that there is only 400 or so deaths? In a country of close to 50 million that’s a decent return.
Plus they are still in lockdown (men and women are allowed outside for 30 minutes on alternate days) until the end of June.
Colombians (jungle-dwelling narco terrorists aside) tend to be quite respectful of rules (excluding when it comes to driving) and authority so a harsh lockdown should be effective.
Bogota’s airport is closed for the next few months, plus Avianca (national carrier) applied for bankruptcy protection last week so there won’t be much in the way of people coming in and out of the country for a while.


More like 700, but they're still in the growth phase - their first recorded death was late March


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 3:12 pm 
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CM11 wrote:
Do Sweden have a weekend dip normally? Good figures from them yesterday and today if not.

Yeah they do but sooner or later they will start getting fewer cases. The big thing is they haven't got anywhere near as many people with antibodies as they thought they would have by now.


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 3:21 pm 
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The first rat jumps ship now the strategy has so obviously failed.

Quote:
Sweden 'wrong' not to shut down, says former state epidemiologist
Scientist who oversaw the response to Sars says country has failed the vulnerable


The predecessor of Sweden’s state epidemiologist has broken her silence on the country’s controversial coronavirus strategy, saying she now believes the authorities should have put in place tougher restrictions in the early stages of the pandemic to bring the virus under control.

Annika Linde, who oversaw Sweden’s response to swine flu and Sars as state epidemiologist from 2005 to 2013, had until now expressed support for her country’s approach under her successor, Anders Tegnell.

But she has now become the first member of the public health establishment to break ranks, saying she has changed her mind as a result of Sweden’s relatively high death toll compared with that of its neighbours, Denmark, Norway, and Finland.

“I think that we needed more time for preparedness. If we had shut down very early ... we would have been able, during that time, to make sure that we had what was necessary to protect the vulnerable,” Linde told the Observer.

For two days last week Sweden had the highest per capita death rate in the world on a seven-day rolling average, and the overall death toll is expected to pass 4,000 this weekend.

Per capita death rates in Denmark, Finland and Norway, which all put in place far-reaching lockdowns, are now, respectively, four, seven and nine times lower than that of Sweden.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... emiologist


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 3:31 pm 
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ovalball wrote:

if you'll believe that then... from a retired teacher no less


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 4:44 pm 
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The circle jerk alt right crew would back him if he was on camera eating babies.


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 4:46 pm 
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Mullet 2 wrote:
The circle jerk alt right crew would back him if he was on camera eating babies.

It's all just nihilistic lib owning.


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 5:00 pm 
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crapbackrow wrote:
ovalball wrote:

if you'll believe that then... from a retired teacher no less


A retired 70yr old using the phrase ‘to search up’, which previously I had only heard teenagers use.


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 5:01 pm 
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What the hell does 'to search up' mean?


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 5:03 pm 
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Gavin Duffy wrote:
What the hell does 'to search up' mean?


It means ‘to google’.


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 5:15 pm 
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Anonymous. wrote:
CM11 wrote:
Do Sweden have a weekend dip normally? Good figures from them yesterday and today if not.

Yeah they do but sooner or later they will start getting fewer cases. The big thing is they haven't got anywhere near as many people with antibodies as they thought they would have by now.


Their numbers have been going down for weeks.

Going on and on about cases. :uhoh:


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 5:16 pm 
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Short Man Syndrome wrote:
crapbackrow wrote:
ovalball wrote:

if you'll believe that then... from a retired teacher no less


A retired 70yr old using the phrase ‘to search up’, which previously I had only heard teenagers use.



Teachers would have very little interaction with the young of course.


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 5:26 pm 
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Blackrock Bullet wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
CM11 wrote:
Do Sweden have a weekend dip normally? Good figures from them yesterday and today if not.

Yeah they do but sooner or later they will start getting fewer cases. The big thing is they haven't got anywhere near as many people with antibodies as they thought they would have by now.


Their numbers have been going down for weeks.

Going on and on about cases. :uhoh:

Look at the graph of their cases versus ours, say. There's is a straight line, ours if nearly flat.


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 5:37 pm 
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Gavin Duffy wrote:
Blackrock Bullet wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
CM11 wrote:
Do Sweden have a weekend dip normally? Good figures from them yesterday and today if not.

Yeah they do but sooner or later they will start getting fewer cases. The big thing is they haven't got anywhere near as many people with antibodies as they thought they would have by now.


Their numbers have been going down for weeks.

Going on and on about cases. :uhoh:

Look at the graph of their cases versus ours, say. There's is a straight line, ours if nearly flat.


Stop being simple. Look at their hospitalisations, ICU admissions and deaths. The curve is going down.

They have broadened their testing.


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 5:50 pm 
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The death rate show a bit of a softening, but not a whole lot.


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 7:09 pm 
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Any Spanish or Italian residents thoughts on the lifting of travel restrictions and opening up for tourism?


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 7:39 pm 
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CM11 wrote:
Any Spanish or Italian residents thoughts on the lifting of travel restrictions and opening up for tourism?

The Brits will be back soon. Nightmare.


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 7:52 pm 
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Mullet 2 wrote:
Short Man Syndrome wrote:
crapbackrow wrote:
ovalball wrote:

if you'll believe that then... from a retired teacher no less


A retired 70yr old using the phrase ‘to search up’, which previously I had only heard teenagers use.



Teachers would have very little interaction with the young of course.


Teachers, of course, are famous for lowering their standards to those of their students.


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 8:51 pm 
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Blackrock Bullet wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
CM11 wrote:
Do Sweden have a weekend dip normally? Good figures from them yesterday and today if not.

Yeah they do but sooner or later they will start getting fewer cases. The big thing is they haven't got anywhere near as many people with antibodies as they thought they would have by now.


Their numbers have been going down for weeks.

Going on and on about cases. :uhoh:

11 days ago they had their 4th highest number of deaths in a day but yes like most other places it's going down. Still best to compare them with their neighbours. Sweden 67 deaths yesterday. Can't see any recorded deaths for their neighbours (Finland,Norway, Denmark) yesterday but it's the weekend and they have been in single figures recently.

However you've previously stressed the point that they were playing the long game. They expected to have 25% of the population of Stockholm with antibodies by the end of April but random testing came up with 7.5%. In other parts of the country, the number of people who tested positive for antibodies was much lower, with 4.2 percent in the far south and 3.7 percent in the region around Gothenburg.

Considering they were hoping for 60% in Stockholm by the middle of June that is probably not going to happen by then. With the number of people having the virus going down all the time it's hard to see how they will ever get anywhere near the magic 60%.


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 9:08 pm 
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Anonymous. wrote:
Blackrock Bullet wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
CM11 wrote:
Do Sweden have a weekend dip normally? Good figures from them yesterday and today if not.

Yeah they do but sooner or later they will start getting fewer cases. The big thing is they haven't got anywhere near as many people with antibodies as they thought they would have by now.


Their numbers have been going down for weeks.

Going on and on about cases. :uhoh:

11 days ago they had their 4th highest number of deaths in a day but yes like most other places it's going down. Still best to compare them with their neighbours. Sweden 67 deaths yesterday. Can't see any recorded deaths for their neighbours (Finland,Norway, Denmark) yesterday but it's the weekend and they have been in single figures recently.

However you've previously stressed the point that they were playing the long game. They expected to have 25% of the population of Stockholm with antibodies by the end of April but random testing came up with 7.5%. In other parts of the country, the number of people who tested positive for antibodies was much lower, with 4.2 percent in the far south and 3.7 percent in the region around Gothenburg.

Considering they were hoping for 60% in Stockholm by the middle of June that is probably not going to happen by then. With the number of people having the virus going down all the time it's hard to see how they will ever get anywhere near the magic 60%.



They've never had a herd immunity (60%) strategy.


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 9:12 pm 
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How is South America doing atm?


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PostPosted: Sun May 24, 2020 9:30 pm 
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Sonny Blount wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
Blackrock Bullet wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
CM11 wrote:
Do Sweden have a weekend dip normally? Good figures from them yesterday and today if not.

Yeah they do but sooner or later they will start getting fewer cases. The big thing is they haven't got anywhere near as many people with antibodies as they thought they would have by now.


Their numbers have been going down for weeks.

Going on and on about cases. :uhoh:

11 days ago they had their 4th highest number of deaths in a day but yes like most other places it's going down. Still best to compare them with their neighbours. Sweden 67 deaths yesterday. Can't see any recorded deaths for their neighbours (Finland,Norway, Denmark) yesterday but it's the weekend and they have been in single figures recently.

However you've previously stressed the point that they were playing the long game. They expected to have 25% of the population of Stockholm with antibodies by the end of April but random testing came up with 7.5%. In other parts of the country, the number of people who tested positive for antibodies was much lower, with 4.2 percent in the far south and 3.7 percent in the region around Gothenburg.

Considering they were hoping for 60% in Stockholm by the middle of June that is probably not going to happen by then. With the number of people having the virus going down all the time it's hard to see how they will ever get anywhere near the magic 60%.



They've never had a herd immunity (60%) strategy.


They are following Anders Tegnells strategy. Call it herd immunity or population immunity i really couldn't give a toss. I know you are one of the people who have been slagging off the lock down strategy (especially in NZ).


Quote:
Tegnell said that, at the population level, if antibodies can't be viewed as an indication of immunity then this undermines the whole rationale for developing a vaccine. "If you can't get population immunity how can we then think a vaccine will protect us?" he said. The precise percentage required for "herd immunity" changes based on the disease. Britain briefly entertained a "herd immunity" strategy before altering course amid a rapidly rising death toll. Britain's chief scientific officer concluded that a figure of 60% might be needed for COVID-19. It could be months before a fuller picture emerges of who remains vulnerable to coronavirus.)

https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/worl ... 031536001/



Quote:
In April, officials estimated one third of Stockholm residents would have contracted Covid-19 by early May, subsequently suggesting that the capital could reach herd immunity of between 40% and 60% by the middle of June.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... oronavirus



Sonny Blount 4th of May wrote:


There are health experts that think lock downs should never have been done.

https://unherd.com/thepost/coming-up-ep ... om-sweden/


Quote:
At least 50% of the population of both the UK and Sweden will be shown to have already had the disease when mass antibody testing becomes available



Lets hope so


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PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2020 3:39 am 
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Anonymous. wrote:
Sonny Blount wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
Blackrock Bullet wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
Their numbers have been going down for weeks.

Going on and on about cases. :uhoh:

11 days ago they had their 4th highest number of deaths in a day but yes like most other places it's going down. Still best to compare them with their neighbours. Sweden 67 deaths yesterday. Can't see any recorded deaths for their neighbours (Finland,Norway, Denmark) yesterday but it's the weekend and they have been in single figures recently.

However you've previously stressed the point that they were playing the long game. They expected to have 25% of the population of Stockholm with antibodies by the end of April but random testing came up with 7.5%. In other parts of the country, the number of people who tested positive for antibodies was much lower, with 4.2 percent in the far south and 3.7 percent in the region around Gothenburg.

Considering they were hoping for 60% in Stockholm by the middle of June that is probably not going to happen by then. With the number of people having the virus going down all the time it's hard to see how they will ever get anywhere near the magic 60%.



They've never had a herd immunity (60%) strategy.


They are following Anders Tegnells strategy. Call it herd immunity or population immunity i really couldn't give a toss. I know you are one of the people who have been slagging off the lock down strategy (especially in NZ).


Quote:
Tegnell said that, at the population level, if antibodies can't be viewed as an indication of immunity then this undermines the whole rationale for developing a vaccine. "If you can't get population immunity how can we then think a vaccine will protect us?" he said. The precise percentage required for "herd immunity" changes based on the disease. Britain briefly entertained a "herd immunity" strategy before altering course amid a rapidly rising death toll. Britain's chief scientific officer concluded that a figure of 60% might be needed for COVID-19. It could be months before a fuller picture emerges of who remains vulnerable to coronavirus.)

https://eu.usatoday.com/story/news/worl ... 031536001/



Quote:
In April, officials estimated one third of Stockholm residents would have contracted Covid-19 by early May, subsequently suggesting that the capital could reach herd immunity of between 40% and 60% by the middle of June.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... oronavirus



Sonny Blount 4th of May wrote:


There are health experts that think lock downs should never have been done.

https://unherd.com/thepost/coming-up-ep ... om-sweden/


Quote:
At least 50% of the population of both the UK and Sweden will be shown to have already had the disease when mass antibody testing becomes available



Lets hope so


The unherd.com, isn't that an alt right loon blog or fake news aggregation site?


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PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2020 4:01 am 
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Ted. wrote:
The unherd.com, isn't that an alt right loon blog or fake news aggregation site?


Not really surprising Sonny and blackrock are fans. These people just won't accept the available evidence shows their herd immunity theory is probably bollocks.

message #2527204 wrote:
Blackrock Bullet wrote:
Latest interview from Unherd, with the Oxford theoretical epidemiologist Sunetra Gupta. Interesting as usual.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DKh6kJ-RSMI


She seemed to be floundering to fit the data to her model. Ie the virus had somehow managed to infect the whole population whilst there where vast percentages that were immune? Theoretically possible I guess, but I'm sure she was expecting the serology to show 100% immunity from those in the front line.
The later parts of the interview were bizarre where she seemed to be suggesting that the West locking down was unfair on third world countries?


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PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2020 4:28 am 
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Anonymous. wrote:
Ted. wrote:
The unherd.com, isn't that an alt right loon blog or fake news aggregation site?


Not really surprising Sonny and blackrock are fans. These people just won't accept the available evidence shows their herd immunity theory is probably bollocks.



I am not a 'fan' of Unherd have no idea what Unherd really is. I have seen 3 interviews in my Twitter feed from that site, just like I see CNN and BBC pieces.

I don't prefer a herd immunity strategy and it's not really being activated. You are being lazy because it suits the level of your thinking.


Last edited by Sonny Blount on Mon May 25, 2020 4:33 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2020 4:31 am 
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Anonymous. wrote:

They are following Anders Tegnells strategy. Call it herd immunity or population immunity i really couldn't give a toss. I know you are one of the people who have been slagging off the lock down strategy (especially in NZ).


Not that simple.

There are infinite possibilities around how and when the lockdowns are being conducted. If you haven't had an idea related to them that differs to what has happened then you are not engaged and have no empathy for the related issues. The government itself is adjusting and making changes as they go, because they admit different ideas exist to what they initially went with.


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PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2020 5:04 am 
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Sonny Blount wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
Ted. wrote:
The unherd.com, isn't that an alt right loon blog or fake news aggregation site?


Not really surprising Sonny and blackrock are fans. These people just won't accept the available evidence shows their herd immunity theory is probably bollocks.



I am not a 'fan' of Unherd have no idea what Unherd really is. I have seen 3 interviews in my Twitter feed from that site, just like I see CNN and BBC pieces.

I don't prefer a herd immunity strategy and it's not really being activated. You are being lazy because it suits the level of your thinking.


Of course you don't

Sonny Blount Sun May 03, 2020 1:38 am wrote:
Well as an anti-Trump right winger who leans towards herd-immunity. I haven't been very impressed by these anti-lockdown protests.


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PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2020 5:17 am 
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Anonymous. wrote:
Sonny Blount wrote:
Anonymous. wrote:
Ted. wrote:
The unherd.com, isn't that an alt right loon blog or fake news aggregation site?


Not really surprising Sonny and blackrock are fans. These people just won't accept the available evidence shows their herd immunity theory is probably bollocks.



I am not a 'fan' of Unherd have no idea what Unherd really is. I have seen 3 interviews in my Twitter feed from that site, just like I see CNN and BBC pieces.

I don't prefer a herd immunity strategy and it's not really being activated. You are being lazy because it suits the level of your thinking.


Of course you don't

Sonny Blount Sun May 03, 2020 1:38 am wrote:
Well as an anti-Trump right winger who leans towards herd-immunity. I haven't been very impressed by these anti-lockdown protests.


No I don't.


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PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2020 5:43 am 
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Herd immunity isn't bollocks. It happens, but there's a great deal of misinformation about what it means. In particular, the herd immunity threshold [which is where the R0 of the infection falls below one with normal social mixing] is being touted as the number where the herd becomes effectively immune.

The importance of R0 < 1 is that the spread of the disease ceases to be exponential, and thus the disease doesn't threaten the integrity of health services. Thus when we talk about herd immunity as a tool in this pandemic, we mean the herd immunity threshold, and only as a way of flattening the curve.

That's not the same as herd immunity. Even after the herd immunity threshold is reached, the disease will continue to spread, at a decreasing rate, until real herd immunity is reached, either due the scarcity of encounters, or a vaccine is produced.

Typically, real herd immunity is reached when north of 90% of people have antibodies. It depends on the transmission mechanism of the disease, and how the authorities deal with it. Numbers like 96% aren't uncommon with natural herd immunity. With vaccines, it's typically the percentage of vaccinated people. Therefore, every unvaccinated person is a risk.

What this means is that while herd immunity is a defence to getting the disease, it's an expensive one. Almost everyone has to get the disease, or be vaccinated. In a country of 60m people, at a 1% fatality rate, ~600k people would die, and millions would become extremely ill. The upside is that many more people may be infected already than we know, making herd immunity closer, and the fatality rate lower.

'Herd immunity' as it tends to be used in these conversations [i.e. the herd immunity threshold, as a means of flattening the curve] is even less of a defence. You're still about as likely to get the disease after it's reached. It simply means that health services are less likely to be overwhelmed. That means you're less likely to die in hospital of some other, treatable illness.

In the real world, an analysis of the cost of a life to society, and the cost in lives of financial hardship, produces numbers that say social distancing and lockdown are preferable to a herd immunity approach, which is why even the most financially conservative governments have preferred them. A second lockdown may severely damage economies. The numbers suggest the financial effects of a second wave of infections would be substantially worse.


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PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2020 8:54 am 
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6.Jones wrote:
Herd immunity isn't bollocks. It happens, but there's a great deal of misinformation about what it means. In particular, the herd immunity threshold [which is where the R0 of the infection falls below one with normal social mixing] is being touted as the number where the herd becomes effectively immune.

The importance of R0 < 1 is that the spread of the disease ceases to be exponential, and thus the disease doesn't threaten the integrity of health services. Thus when we talk about herd immunity as a tool in this pandemic, we mean the herd immunity threshold, and only as a way of flattening the curve.

That's not the same as herd immunity. Even after the herd immunity threshold is reached, the disease will continue to spread, at a decreasing rate, until real herd immunity is reached, either due the scarcity of encounters, or a vaccine is produced.

Typically, real herd immunity is reached when north of 90% of people have antibodies. It depends on the transmission mechanism of the disease, and how the authorities deal with it. Numbers like 96% aren't uncommon with natural herd immunity. With vaccines, it's typically the percentage of vaccinated people. Therefore, every unvaccinated person is a risk.

What this means is that while herd immunity is a defence to getting the disease, it's an expensive one. Almost everyone has to get the disease, or be vaccinated. In a country of 60m people, at a 1% fatality rate, ~600k people would die, and millions would become extremely ill. The upside is that many more people may be infected already than we know, making herd immunity closer, and the fatality rate lower.

'Herd immunity' as it tends to be used in these conversations [i.e. the herd immunity threshold, as a means of flattening the curve] is even less of a defence. You're still about as likely to get the disease after it's reached. It simply means that health services are less likely to be overwhelmed. That means you're less likely to die in hospital of some other, treatable illness.

In the real world, an analysis of the cost of a life to society, and the cost in lives of financial hardship, produces numbers that say social distancing and lockdown are preferable to a herd immunity approach, which is why even the most financially conservative governments have preferred them. A second lockdown may severely damage economies. The numbers suggest the financial effects of a second wave of infections would be substantially worse.

I think we all understand the basics of herd immunity. I was talking about the available evidence as regards Sweden reaching herd immunity or population immunity (as Tagnell put it) or 40 to 60% of the population with antibodies by mid June. Not as a general principle. As he said what would be the point of a vaccination if herd immunity as a principle didn't work.

it is indeed bollocks


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PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2020 10:39 am 
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Good article in the Beeb at the weekend

https://www.bbc.com/news/amp/52760992


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PostPosted: Mon May 25, 2020 10:51 am 
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message #2527204 wrote:
Good article in the Beeb at the weekend

https://www.bbc.com/news/amp/52760992

Thanks.

What's interesting to me is the very specific way that this disease attacks, which is detailed in that article. If the mechanism can be understood (and it seems that there are many clues in the way that the body responds to it), then that should be a signpost towards treating it.


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