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 Post subject: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:13 pm 
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US CDC research shows that chloroquine also has strong potential as a prophylactic (preventative) measure against coronavirus in the lab, while we wait for a vaccine to be developed. Chloroquine is an inexpensive, globally available drug that has been in widespread human use since 1945 against malaria, autoimmune and various other conditions.

Dr Roy Spencer wrote:
On the subject of using antimalarial drugs for COVID-19 treatment, I've compared COVID-19 cases versus malaria incidence by country....

This is amazing. I downloaded all of the data for 234 countries, incidence of total COVID-19 cases (as of 3/17/2020) versus the incidence of malaria in those countries (various sources, kinda messy matching everything up in Excel).

RESULTS, Multi-country average malaria cases per thousand, COVID-19 cases per million, in three classes of countries based on malaria incidence:

Top 40 Malaria countries: 212 malaria = 0.2 COVID-19;
Next 40 Malaria countries: 7.3 malaria = 10.1 COVID-19
Remaining (81-234) countries: 0.00 malaria = 68.7 COVID-19

Again, the units are Malaria cases per thousand "population at risk", and COVID-19 cases per million total population.

In all my years of data analysis I have never seen such a stark and strong relationship: Countries with malaria basically have no COVID-19 cases (at least not yet).


Image

The UK Government have known about the immunity to Covid-19 granted by chloroquine for more than a month since on February 26, 2020, they added chloroquine to the list of medicines that cannot be parallel exported from the UK. Chloroquine was never on this list before.


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:17 pm 
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No offence but we're going to need something a bit more rigorous than the opinions of the meteorologist who thinks climate change is a hoax and is a big fan of intelligent design


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:20 pm 
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JM2K6 wrote:
No offence but we're going to need something a bit more rigorous than the opinions of the meteorologist who thinks climate change is a hoax and is a big fan of intelligent design



Definitely the opinion of a “tech bloke” first I agree .


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:20 pm 
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bimboman wrote:
JM2K6 wrote:
No offence but we're going to need something a bit more rigorous than the opinions of the meteorologist who thinks climate change is a hoax and is a big fan of intelligent design



Definitely the opinion of a “tech bloke” first I agree .


You just can't help yourself, can you?


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:22 pm 
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JM2K6 wrote:
bimboman wrote:
JM2K6 wrote:
No offence but we're going to need something a bit more rigorous than the opinions of the meteorologist who thinks climate change is a hoax and is a big fan of intelligent design



Definitely the opinion of a “tech bloke” first I agree .


You just can't help yourself, can you?



At pointing out your absolute arrogance, it’s difficult not to.


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:24 pm 
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An extrovert French doctor/biologist has put forward this "solution".

He tested 24 patients, those with chloroquine had a 75% recovery, those without only 10% recovery.

I'd be vary wary of any "miracle" solution myself.

My brother took malaria drugs years ago before going to SE asia and said he would rather risk COVID-19 than these kindds of drugs...


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:25 pm 
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Not a scientist here, but I can see several repetitions between both maps.

Also, (going back to a previously explored issue) isn't there a coincidence that the same countries with low COVID incidence have the highest number of pirates???


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:26 pm 
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bimboman wrote:
JM2K6 wrote:
bimboman wrote:
JM2K6 wrote:
No offence but we're going to need something a bit more rigorous than the opinions of the meteorologist who thinks climate change is a hoax and is a big fan of intelligent design



Definitely the opinion of a “tech bloke” first I agree .


You just can't help yourself, can you?



At pointing out your absolute arrogance, it’s difficult not to.


Bimbo, your reply only works if JM is spouting his own cures and solutions. Which, as far as I can see, he isn't.


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:27 pm 
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bimboman wrote:
JM2K6 wrote:
bimboman wrote:
JM2K6 wrote:
No offence but we're going to need something a bit more rigorous than the opinions of the meteorologist who thinks climate change is a hoax and is a big fan of intelligent design



Definitely the opinion of a “tech bloke” first I agree .


You just can't help yourself, can you?


At pointing out your absolute arrogance, it’s difficult not to.


OK I'll try this once and once only.

There is nothing arrogant about saying that posting a thread on this where the evidence presented is some bloke with an extremely dubious history when it comes to science, who is not an expert on any aspect of this topic, tosses off an opinion and presents this as some sort of scientific fact is an act that deserves to be questioned. You yourself have been very vocal about the need to listen to experts recently, and to consider the source carefully. This is all basic stuff and at no point am I putting forth my own knowledge of the topic as some kind of alternative. That might indeed be arrogant.

Can you please stuff your dislike of me back in the locker and try and understand that people like Fat Albert posting poorly sourced, unverified, and disingenuous misinformation from his favourite sources as new threads is not going to help this board one bit? It's okay if you like Fat Albert and don't like me. But please try and bin the kneejerk nonsense whenever I post anything.


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:29 pm 
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clementinfrance wrote:
My brother took malaria drugs years ago before going to SE asia and said he would rather risk COVID-19 than these kindds of drugs...
Lariam?


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:30 pm 
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Maybe it's because countries that have high rates of malaria are generally really poor, and poor countries aren't able to test effectively or widely for COVID 19?


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:31 pm 
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Mr Mike wrote:
clementinfrance wrote:
My brother took malaria drugs years ago before going to SE asia and said he would rather risk COVID-19 than these kindds of drugs...
Lariam?


Not sure TBH, but he said it was hell.


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:31 pm 
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JM2K6 wrote:
No offence but we're going to need something a bit more rigorous than the opinions of the meteorologist who thinks climate change is a hoax and is a big fan of intelligent design

Or Roy Spencer.


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:32 pm 
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clementinfrance wrote:
Mr Mike wrote:
clementinfrance wrote:
My brother took malaria drugs years ago before going to SE asia and said he would rather risk COVID-19 than these kindds of drugs...
Lariam?


Not sure TBH, but he said it was hell.

Physical or psychological?


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:33 pm 
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Mr Mike wrote:
clementinfrance wrote:
Mr Mike wrote:
clementinfrance wrote:
My brother took malaria drugs years ago before going to SE asia and said he would rather risk COVID-19 than these kindds of drugs...
Lariam?


Not sure TBH, but he said it was hell.

Physical or psychological?


Physically mainly, I think.


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:37 pm 
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Larium f**ked me up big time.


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:39 pm 
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ukjim wrote:
Larium f**ked me up big time.

My wife also, but all psychological effects, went completely mental.

20 years later I’m still waiting for her to recover.


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:41 pm 
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Hmmm

Such a standard response, ignore the content, bash the messenger. And be wrong about facts all the time.

What does anything the atmospheric scientist wrote in connection with a simple statistical analysis of publicly available WHO data have to do with CO2, back radiation or GOD? Are you really that insecure?

Remdesivir and chloroquine effectively inhibit the recently emerged novel coronavirus (2019-nCoV) in vitro (Nature)

Chloroquine phosphate has shown apparent efficacy in treatment of COVID-19 associated pneumonia in clinical studies

An effective treatment for coronavirus (COVID-19)


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:42 pm 
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JM2K6 wrote:
No offence but we're going to need something a bit more rigorous than the opinions of the meteorologist who thinks climate change is a hoax and is a big fan of intelligent design

Chloroquine has already got a jersey here on the bored. Someone posted an article about it not long ago. This may have been it: https://www.abc.net.au/news/health/2020 ... 9/12067496


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:45 pm 
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Fat Albert wrote:
Hmmm

Such a standard response, ignore the content, bash the messenger. And be wrong about facts all the time.

What does anything the atmospheric scientist wrote in connection with a simple statistical analysis of publicly available WHO data have to do with CO2, back radiation or GOD? Are you really that insecure?


Simple statistical analysis tends to be wrong, and someone's opinion on something when presenting analysis + opining on it shouldn't be treated as gospel unless they are an expert in the field, especially if they've form for saying some pretty bonkers shit in the past.

Quote:


This, however, is much more what I'm talking about. Thank you.


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:45 pm 
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There's only one person posting posting poorly researched comment on this thread.


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:49 pm 
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Iran is on both maps


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:50 pm 
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Man In Black wrote:
JMK - I agree with you, but there is a massive amount of rumour being thrown around at the moment everywhere on the bored.


Although very rarely posted authoritively as a new thread and that


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 12:57 pm 
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JM2K6 wrote:
Man In Black wrote:
JMK - I agree with you, but there is a massive amount of rumour being thrown around at the moment everywhere on the bored.


Although very rarely posted authoritively as a new thread and that


Have you been hanging out with Newport people? You need to drop the last t.


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:00 pm 
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Quote:
chloroquine also has strong potential as a prophylactic (preventative) measure against Coronavirus
One would hope so because those maps suggest it is pretty shitty at preventing malaria.

Gin and tonic next on the panic buying list.


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:01 pm 
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Mr Mike wrote:
ukjim wrote:
Larium f**ked me up big time.

My wife also, but all psychological effects, went completely mental.

20 years later I’m still waiting for her to recover.


:lol: I had no noticeable side effects but mate of mine went gaga on it, paranoid hunter s Thompson type episode ; went off it and said he'd taken his chances in Cambodia 15 years ago instead


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:03 pm 
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I, like Dr Spencer was taken with the inverse correlation between number of confirmed cases of Covid-19 and the prevalence of malaria (= high % of population ingesting chloroquine). Of course, correlation does not mean causation, but it's pretty convincing.

Having read the papers it's also clear that chloroquine is effective in both prevention and in reducing recovery time as the closing paragraph of the Nature article summary states
Quote:
Our findings reveal that remdesivir and chloroquine are highly effective in the control of 2019-nCoV infection in vitro. Since these compounds have been used in human patients with a safety track record and shown to be effective against various ailments, we suggest that they should be assessed in human patients suffering from the novel coronavirus disease.
My take is it works, it's safe (in as much as any approved drug is safe), it's cheap and is commonly available.

My question is why hasn't mass distribution occured?


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:10 pm 
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Fat Albert wrote:
I, like Dr Spencer was taken with the inverse correlation between number of confirmed cases of Covid-19 and the prevalence of malaria (= high % of population ingesting chloroquine). Of course, correlation does not mean causation, but it's pretty convincing.

Having read the papers it's also clear that chloroquine is effective in both prevention and in reducing recovery time as the closing paragraph of the Nature article summary states
Quote:
Our findings reveal that remdesivir and chloroquine are highly effective in the control of 2019-nCoV infection in vitro. Since these compounds have been used in human patients with a safety track record and shown to be effective against various ailments, we suggest that they should be assessed in human patients suffering from the novel coronavirus disease.
My take is it works, it's safe (in as much as any approved drug is safe), it's cheap and is commonly available.

My question is why hasn't mass distribution occured?


It's likely to be something as mundane as needing to be actually approved for use against this virus first. The studies so far as the sort of thing that get drugs earmarked for wider trials, and there's obviously going to be a real push for something as fast as possible, but they're not yet willing to abandon the usual methods for getting something into widespread use.

https://www.fiercepharma.com/pharma/bay ... ght-report - good to see donations of it happening though


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:31 pm 
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Mr Mike wrote:
Quote:
chloroquine also has strong potential as a prophylactic (preventative) measure against Coronavirus
One would hope so because those maps suggest it is pretty shitty at preventing malaria.

Gin and tonic next on the panic buying list.


A friend of mine will start a research on gin and tonics.


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:38 pm 
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ID2 wrote:
Iran is on both maps


Everyone is Iran has now been cured. Allan Akbar!


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:41 pm 
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JM2K6 wrote:
Fat Albert wrote:
I, like Dr Spencer was taken with the inverse correlation between number of confirmed cases of Covid-19 and the prevalence of malaria (= high % of population ingesting chloroquine). Of course, correlation does not mean causation, but it's pretty convincing.

Having read the papers it's also clear that chloroquine is effective in both prevention and in reducing recovery time as the closing paragraph of the Nature article summary states
Quote:
Our findings reveal that remdesivir and chloroquine are highly effective in the control of 2019-nCoV infection in vitro. Since these compounds have been used in human patients with a safety track record and shown to be effective against various ailments, we suggest that they should be assessed in human patients suffering from the novel coronavirus disease.
My take is it works, it's safe (in as much as any approved drug is safe), it's cheap and is commonly available.

My question is why hasn't mass distribution occured?


It's likely to be something as mundane as needing to be actually approved for use against this virus first. The studies so far as the sort of thing that get drugs earmarked for wider trials, and there's obviously going to be a real push for something as fast as possible, but they're not yet willing to abandon the usual methods for getting something into widespread use.

https://www.fiercepharma.com/pharma/bay ... ght-report - good to see donations of it happening though


Nor should they abandon the process of actually checking to see if it works, promising correlations not withstanding.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=liiVX55tJ7E


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:48 pm 
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Fat Albert wrote:
I, like Dr Spencer was taken with the inverse correlation between number of confirmed cases of Covid-19 and the prevalence of malaria (= high % of population ingesting chloroquine). Of course, correlation does not mean causation, but it's pretty convincing.

Having read the papers it's also clear that chloroquine is effective in both prevention and in reducing recovery time as the closing paragraph of the Nature article summary states
Quote:
Our findings reveal that remdesivir and chloroquine are highly effective in the control of 2019-nCoV infection in vitro. Since these compounds have been used in human patients with a safety track record and shown to be effective against various ailments, we suggest that they should be assessed in human patients suffering from the novel coronavirus disease.
My take is it works, it's safe (in as much as any approved drug is safe), it's cheap and is commonly available.

My question is why hasn't mass distribution occured?

I think chloroquine has side effects and probably more so in those older people more vulnerable to the bad corona virus. Pregnant and breast feeding women, those with heart conditions, too.
I'm guessing it also requires a doctor's prescription too because of the above. And 80-90% of people appear to only get a mild form of the disease.


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:49 pm 
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PornDog wrote:
JM2K6 wrote:
Fat Albert wrote:
I, like Dr Spencer was taken with the inverse correlation between number of confirmed cases of Covid-19 and the prevalence of malaria (= high % of population ingesting chloroquine). Of course, correlation does not mean causation, but it's pretty convincing.

Having read the papers it's also clear that chloroquine is effective in both prevention and in reducing recovery time as the closing paragraph of the Nature article summary states
Quote:
Our findings reveal that remdesivir and chloroquine are highly effective in the control of 2019-nCoV infection in vitro. Since these compounds have been used in human patients with a safety track record and shown to be effective against various ailments, we suggest that they should be assessed in human patients suffering from the novel coronavirus disease.
My take is it works, it's safe (in as much as any approved drug is safe), it's cheap and is commonly available.

My question is why hasn't mass distribution occured?


It's likely to be something as mundane as needing to be actually approved for use against this virus first. The studies so far as the sort of thing that get drugs earmarked for wider trials, and there's obviously going to be a real push for something as fast as possible, but they're not yet willing to abandon the usual methods for getting something into widespread use.

https://www.fiercepharma.com/pharma/bay ... ght-report - good to see donations of it happening though


Nor should they abandon the process of actually checking to see if it works, promising correlations not withstanding.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=liiVX55tJ7E


Aye, hence the wider trials


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 1:52 pm 
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Mr Mike wrote:
ukjim wrote:
Larium f**ked me up big time.

My wife also, but all psychological effects, went completely mental.

20 years later I’m still waiting for her to recover.


Yeah, not sure there is a causal link there. Mine never took Larium


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 4:09 pm 
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Ali's Choice wrote:
Maybe it's because countries that have high rates of malaria are generally really poor, and poor countries aren't able to test effectively or widely for COVID 19?


This...but also those countries are also not main transit hubs for air travel out of China and Europe.

Covid-19 Models based purely on flight routes and frequency yielded exactly these results with sub-Saharan Africa and South America being the last places to be hit. Unfortunately, once they are hit, they will have some of the worst infrastructure to deal with the problem :(

That being said, I really hope there is something to this claim. It will be the best news since this shit started. Hope the trials go well :thumbup:


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:04 pm 
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From the Trump presser right now

Quote:
FDA commish Stephen Hahn: The president has directed us to "take a closer look" at the use of anti-malaria drug chloroquine for possible use re the coronavirus, and "we want to do that in the setting of a clinical trial."


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:30 pm 
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Quote:
Both chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine appear to be zinc ionophores. It is the zinc that interferes with a virus. The Corona Virus is an RNA virus. When a virus goes into the cytosol, the ribosomes which read the code of the mRNA can’t tell the difference between the virus RNA and cellular RNA. So, as the ribosomes read the viral RNA they make an RNA dependent RNA polymerase (Replicase) that replicates the viral RNA. It’s a nasty son of a bitch. Zn(2+) will interfere with Replicase. However, zinc doesn’t readily transport inside the cell but, a zinc ionophore helps zinc move inside the cell.


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:49 pm 
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clementinfrance wrote:
An extrovert French doctor/biologist has put forward this "solution".

He tested 24 patients, those with chloroquine had a 75% recovery, those without only 10% recovery.

I'd be vary wary of any "miracle" solution myself.

My brother took malaria drugs years ago before going to SE asia and said he would rather risk COVID-19 than these kindds of drugs...


That this one:

https://drive.google.com/file/d/186Bel9 ... HnGbj/view


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 5:51 pm 
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Fat Albert wrote:
Quote:
Both chloroquine and hydroxychloroquine appear to be zinc ionophores. It is the zinc that interferes with a virus. The Corona Virus is an RNA virus. When a virus goes into the cytosol, the ribosomes which read the code of the mRNA can’t tell the difference between the virus RNA and cellular RNA. So, as the ribosomes read the viral RNA they make an RNA dependent RNA polymerase (Replicase) that replicates the viral RNA. It’s a nasty son of a bitch. Zn(2+) will interfere with Replicase. However, zinc doesn’t readily transport inside the cell but, a zinc ionophore helps zinc move inside the cell.

Just what I was going to say.


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 Post subject: Re: Malaria & Covid-19
PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2020 8:16 pm 
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Both drugs have been approved for human use - but not combined use.

They are only effective against active infection.

The problem that needs sorting is that most people who get serious -> fatal infections have underlying medical conditions that probably need other drugs to treat them. No-one knows if the combination will affect the efficacy of the drugs being used to treat those conditions. That's what needs to be sorted out.

Not really clever to be able to say "well we cured the Coronavirus - pity the drugs that did that caused him to die of his other conditions"


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