Re: SARU - " Totsiens Verloorders!"
Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2020 12:17 pm
Big if true
Makes sense
Nobody should have to deal with that amount of jet lag
Makes sense
Nobody should have to deal with that amount of jet lag
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Ali's Choice wrote:Yes, that will be a great opportunity for young Saffers to earn money as teenagers. But whilst they are being recruited straight from school, to learn their craft in the inferior Welsh, Scottish and Italian academy programs, the best Kiwi players will continue to develop and blossom in NZ's world class systems.Clogs wrote:Because even more SA kids can head over to get paid in Europe straight from the school system than get locked into the academies in SA. Far more opportunities, bigger pool better boks playing with and against fellow boks in the same comp.
A question for South African Rugby fans, will there be any unintended consequences associated with SA teams joining the Pro 18? Your club/franchise pro-Rugby season will effectively run from September to the end of May. I know the Cheetahs and Kings have been involved for a season and a half already, but how will Rugby fare as a summer sport in South Africa?Frequent Flyer wrote:Big if true
Makes sense
Nobody should have to deal with that amount of jet lag
You're not still, at this late stage, trying to pretend that South African money keeps NZ and Australia afloat, are you? Your players earned a tiny fraction of what our's did. The game has always been poor in your country. Because despite having more people watching Rugby in SA, most of them earn less than USD$1 per day.DraadkarD wrote:Ali's Choice wrote:Yes, that will be a great opportunity for young Saffers to earn money as teenagers. But whilst they are being recruited straight from school, to learn their craft in the inferior Welsh, Scottish and Italian academy programs, the best Kiwi players will continue to develop and blossom in NZ's world class systems.Clogs wrote:Because even more SA kids can head over to get paid in Europe straight from the school system than get locked into the academies in SA. Far more opportunities, bigger pool better boks playing with and against fellow boks in the same comp.
Will they develop and blossom for free? Cutting the viewership by 80% might cause some "budget" issues.
And your players are paid a pittance in comparison.Lemoentjie wrote: The majority of the people paying for supersport and other SR related services or items aren't those earning very little money. Don't forget there's almost as many whites in SA (a small minority of the population) as the whole population in New Zealand. And average wages are much higher than your uninformed claims
I don't see it being an issue. SR pre-season starts in December anyway, so players are used to the heat. But perhaps we'll see more evening games.Ali's Choice wrote:A question for South African Rugby fans, will there be any unintended consequences associated with SA teams joining the Pro 18? Your club/franchise pro-Rugby season will effectively run from September to the end of May. I know the Cheetahs and Kings have been involved for a season and a half already, but how will Rugby fare as a summer sport in South Africa?
Might help if their squads aren’t so large. The Sharks named a 45 man squad for Super Rugby this year.mr bungle wrote:And your players are paid a pittance in comparison.Lemoentjie wrote: The majority of the people paying for supersport and other SR related services or items aren't those earning very little money. Don't forget there's almost as many whites in SA (a small minority of the population) as the whole population in New Zealand. And average wages are much higher than your uninformed claims
A bit misleading as SA unions are limited to 45 pro players. That is for SR, Currie Cup, SSRC and Junior rugby, The rest of the players are semi-pro and amateurBrumby_in_Vic wrote:Might help if their squads aren’t so large. The Sharks named a 45 man squad for Super Rugby this year.mr bungle wrote:And your players are paid a pittance in comparison.Lemoentjie wrote: The majority of the people paying for supersport and other SR related services or items aren't those earning very little money. Don't forget there's almost as many whites in SA (a small minority of the population) as the whole population in New Zealand. And average wages are much higher than your uninformed claims
There is no f**king way you can play rugby in full Summer in Durban even at night.Ali's Choice wrote:A question for South African Rugby fans, will there be any unintended consequences associated with SA teams joining the Pro 18? Your club/franchise pro-Rugby season will effectively run from September to the end of May. I know the Cheetahs and Kings have been involved for a season and a half already, but how will Rugby fare as a summer sport in South Africa?Frequent Flyer wrote:Big if true
Makes sense
Nobody should have to deal with that amount of jet lag
Are CVC the new boogeymen of rugby? Anything remotely connected with profit is now linked with them is itmdaclarke wrote:If this is true, then it has CVC's fingerprints all over it.
The feeling is mutual, most Australians can't stand the South African teams. So useless, and shamelessly aided and abetted by their crooked home-town referees. Seems like South Africa finally leaving for 'easy rugby' will be a win-win for all parties. That's a brilliant outcomeCartman wrote:I wont miss some SR teams at all
Mostly the Aussie teams, cannot stand most of them
Bye bye
That could happen if the SARU can organise for direct invitations in the Heineken Cup, but then your CC would need to be organised around that, which might not be simple.Jensrsa wrote:Whatever is happening I want to see the Currie Cup brought back to be the premier Saffer comp with the top 2 or 3 teams competing for international honours against the Kiwis, French and English. The rest don't really count
Not simple at all but not only about the Saffers. It's about re-organising the HC to include the Pro14, Top14, PR, NPC and CCAli's Choice wrote:That could happen if the SARU can organise for direct invitations in the Heineken Cup, but then your CC would need to be organised around that, which might not be simple.Jensrsa wrote:Whatever is happening I want to see the Currie Cup brought back to be the premier Saffer comp with the top 2 or 3 teams competing for international honours against the Kiwis, French and English. The rest don't really count
I would like a standalone Currie Cup (With Cheetahs and Kings) with the top 6 qualifying to the Heineken Cup. Likewise the top 6 of the Pro 12, Top 14 and Gallagher Premiership. Would then have an overarching competition of 24 clubs.Jensrsa wrote:Not simple at all but not only about the Saffers. It's about re-organising the HC to include the Pro14, Top14, PR, NPC and CCAli's Choice wrote:That could happen if the SARU can organise for direct invitations in the Heineken Cup, but then your CC would need to be organised around that, which might not be simple.Jensrsa wrote:Whatever is happening I want to see the Currie Cup brought back to be the premier Saffer comp with the top 2 or 3 teams competing for international honours against the Kiwis, French and English. The rest don't really count
CC to be 6 teams, top 3 to qualify for the HC style compmdaclarke wrote:I would like a standalone Currie Cup (With Cheetahs and Kings) with the top 6 qualifying to the Heineken Cup. Likewise the top 6 of the Pro 12, Top 14 and Gallagher Premiership. Would then have an overarching competition of 24 clubs.Jensrsa wrote:Not simple at all but not only about the Saffers. It's about re-organising the HC to include the Pro14, Top14, PR, NPC and CCAli's Choice wrote:That could happen if the SARU can organise for direct invitations in the Heineken Cup, but then your CC would need to be organised around that, which might not be simple.Jensrsa wrote:Whatever is happening I want to see the Currie Cup brought back to be the premier Saffer comp with the top 2 or 3 teams competing for international honours against the Kiwis, French and English. The rest don't really count
Then have 4 x 6 Pools, top 2 from each pool going to QF and so on.
Don't see the Saffers going for that, they will want a minimum of 4 teams in HC (Bulls, Lions, Sharks, Stormers)Jensrsa wrote:CC to be 6 teams, top 3 to qualify for the HC style compmdaclarke wrote:I would like a standalone Currie Cup (With Cheetahs and Kings) with the top 6 qualifying to the Heineken Cup. Likewise the top 6 of the Pro 12, Top 14 and Gallagher Premiership. Would then have an overarching competition of 24 clubs.Jensrsa wrote:Not simple at all but not only about the Saffers. It's about re-organising the HC to include the Pro14, Top14, PR, NPC and CCAli's Choice wrote:That could happen if the SARU can organise for direct invitations in the Heineken Cup, but then your CC would need to be organised around that, which might not be simple.Jensrsa wrote:Whatever is happening I want to see the Currie Cup brought back to be the premier Saffer comp with the top 2 or 3 teams competing for international honours against the Kiwis, French and English. The rest don't really count
Then have 4 x 6 Pools, top 2 from each pool going to QF and so on.
The challenge is that it's not just the pro level that would need to switch to summer, all the levels below this would also need to switch to ensure that there was a pool of developing playing ready to step up if needed. The pro's can play under lights but this may not be possible at school and club level.sorCrer wrote:There is no f**king way you can play rugby in full Summer in Durban even at night.Ali's Choice wrote:A question for South African Rugby fans, will there be any unintended consequences associated with SA teams joining the Pro 18? Your club/franchise pro-Rugby season will effectively run from September to the end of May. I know the Cheetahs and Kings have been involved for a season and a half already, but how will Rugby fare as a summer sport in South Africa?Frequent Flyer wrote:Big if true
Makes sense
Nobody should have to deal with that amount of jet lag
While I will miss watching some of the Super Rugby, a move would probably benefit us. If we can build the Currie Cup back to what it was and develop the Gold Cup and Varsity Cup, as well as the under 20 competition, we will have a continuous flow of talent. We need to get the crowds back. Schools rugby attracts massive crowds countrywide and we need to tap that to build the commercial side of the game.Jensrsa wrote:Whatever is happening I want to see the Currie Cup brought back to be the premier Saffer comp with the top 2 or 3 teams competing for international honours against the Kiwis, French and English. The rest don't really count
I think the format has been rubbish for some time. 14 teams was about the max, but Super 12 was a grand time, IMHO. It was unique and new. Skill level high, rugby was really expanding as a game with the likes of Cullen, Umaga, Lomu, Wilson amongst countless others including the rise of the Brumbies which resulted in some dominant Wallabies seasons as well. As the years rolled on, the geographic constraints really hit home and don't help grow the rivalries or connect fans across the countries involved. Night rugby was also a novelty for a number of seasons but that wore off as well.DraadkarD wrote:I know Ali is trolling and he just hates us, but Super Rugby is the by far the best "club" competition globally and it will really be sad if we leave.
Far be it from me to criticise an organisation like the fabulous and well-lawyered CVC, but...openclashXX wrote:Are CVC the new boogeymen of rugby? Anything remotely connected with profit is now linked with them is itmdaclarke wrote:If this is true, then it has CVC's fingerprints all over it.
Well it makes a change from PRL or Mourad Boudjellal I suppose
I agree. And the format should not have changed. But, there is a big difference in the quality of the games between Soup and Pro 14. I was really sad when the Cheetahs were kicked out. Watched some great games at the Free State Stadium.mr bungle wrote:I think the format has been rubbish for some time. 14 teams was about the max, but Super 12 was a grand time, IMHO. It was unique and new. Skill level high, rugby was really expanding as a game with the likes of Cullen, Umaga, Lomu, Wilson amongst countless others including the rise of the Brumbies which resulted in some dominant Wallabies seasons as well. As the years rolled on, the geographic constraints really hit home and don't help grow the rivalries or connect fans across the countries involved. Night rugby was also a novelty for a number of seasons but that wore off as well.DraadkarD wrote:I know Ali is trolling and he just hates us, but Super Rugby is the by far the best "club" competition globally and it will really be sad if we leave.
You've got that backwards. All Blacks tests are the only international fixtures that consistently sell out larger stadiums in the Republic, and usually at a premium ticket pricing point. SARU are going to make sure they never kill that cash cow.Wilson's Toffee wrote:NZ will fall over their feet to host Springbok games
Trolling? I simply quoted an article that was widely available online. The SARU has been threatening to move to the NH since the inception of Super Rugby, and NZ and Australia have finally called their bluff.DraadkarD wrote:I know Ali is trolling and he just hates us, but Super Rugby is the by far the best "club" competition globally and it will really be sad if we leave.
Help me out here, why does it have to be one or the other?openclashXX wrote:Are CVC the new boogeymen of rugby? Anything remotely connected with profit is now linked with them is itmdaclarke wrote:If this is true, then it has CVC's fingerprints all over it.
Well it makes a change from PRL or Mourad Boudjellal I suppose
The obvious answer is to exclude the Sharks.sorCrer wrote:There is no f**king way you can play rugby in full Summer in Durban even at night.Ali's Choice wrote:A question for South African Rugby fans, will there be any unintended consequences associated with SA teams joining the Pro 18? Your club/franchise pro-Rugby season will effectively run from September to the end of May. I know the Cheetahs and Kings have been involved for a season and a half already, but how will Rugby fare as a summer sport in South Africa?Frequent Flyer wrote:Big if true
Makes sense
Nobody should have to deal with that amount of jet lag
Nah just make them play in PE.Sandstorm wrote:The obvious answer is to exclude the Sharks.sorCrer wrote:There is no f**king way you can play rugby in full Summer in Durban even at night.Ali's Choice wrote:A question for South African Rugby fans, will there be any unintended consequences associated with SA teams joining the Pro 18? Your club/franchise pro-Rugby season will effectively run from September to the end of May. I know the Cheetahs and Kings have been involved for a season and a half already, but how will Rugby fare as a summer sport in South Africa?Frequent Flyer wrote:Big if true
Makes sense
Nobody should have to deal with that amount of jet lag
I don't blame you. The Italian, Welsh and Scottish nothing-teams are not the most awe inspiring opposition. In saying that, the South African teams should do very well against them and another huge positive is that all your matches will be played at viewer friendly times. The only real downside I can see for you guys is switching pro-Rugby to a summer sport. I think this might have loads of unintended negative outcomes.assfly wrote:Apart from some of the big Irish teams, there isn't that much of a draw for me.
Trans Tasman Rugby will still attract European viewers, and the test matches will still draw big global audiences. Moreover, you act as if NZ and Australia aren't wealthy countries and big sports markets in their own right. The NRL, a tiny, niche sport played in only two Australian states, just signed a new $2 billion AUD TV rights deal in the middle of a global pandemic. There is massive amounts of TV money floating around this part of the world if the product is right. And the product was never going to be right if it involved South African timezones.Catman wrote:Ali's dream of time zone friendly fixtures works both ways though. There will certainly be almost no interest in televising ANZAC rugby in Europe, and absolutely none in SA if there are no saffa teams participating. Revenue from dwindling TV and live audiences will decline, and more ANZAC players will logically opt for Europe. This will further erode the quality of ANZACSR (TM) and (in Australia at least), rugby will drift even further down the ratings relative to AFL and NRL.
Eventually the lack of depth and quality of the ANZACSR will force even NZ to make overseas players eligible for the AB's/.
I honestly think that in ten years, neither NZ nor Australia will be serious contenders for top 3 spots in world rugby. Neither will win another world cup for at least a generation.
Personally I am saddened by the split and the loss of the special rivalry with NZ especially. But times change and rugby needs to change with it. For better or worse.
NZ's demise has been predicted for many seasons now. I prefer to deal in facts. For 3 whole years from Sep 2016 to Sep 2019 the Springboks were ranked outside the top 3 test sides. Dipping as low as 8th and averaging 6th place.Catman wrote: I honestly think that in ten years, neither NZ nor Australia will be serious contenders for top 3 spots in world rugby. Neither will win another world cup for at least a generation.
That's just the Kiwi crowd catching a game where they will definitely emerge as the winners.naki wrote:Wilson's Toffee wrote:NZ will fall over their feet to host Springbok games
Springbok tests in NZ are not as much of a draw, often being farmed out to smaller venues like Albany or the temporary Christchurch shithole "stadium". They sell out, as All Blacks tests always do in NZ, but not on the scale of Bledisloe tests which - despite being a non-contest for decades now - are usually held at Eden Park which is by far the country's biggest venue yet hasn't housed the Boks in nearly a decade.