Melbourne. Fvcked.

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Slim 293
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Slim 293 »

jdogscoop wrote:Tim Smith is an absolute waste of skin.

But Andrew Bolt has the scoop on how to flatten the curve... for good!

For some reason it involves opening up restaurants. :lol:
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MungoMan
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by MungoMan »

Farva wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:Any resident Melbourne posters go to work today? Am trying to confirm the rules around work restrictions as it is not clear from the statement by the Premier yesterday and media reports today.

What I have noticed is:
  • Restaurants, cafes and markets are all allowed to trade for takeaways only.

    Hairdressers are still open.

    Butchers, bakers and shopping malls are all still open.
These are already some of the big differences between NZ L4 and Melbourne L4. In NZ none of this was possible.
Its not kicked in yet. There is an announcement today to explain what is and is not allowed.
I doubt that shopping malls or hairdressers will remain open.
I would assume that butchers and bakers will be - they are effectively supermarkets.
The relevant Chief Health Officer direction came into force midnight last night. Hairdressers may continue trading if they comply with the records requirement in the direction. They’re also subject to the one person per 4 sq.m. requirement.
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jdogscoop
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by jdogscoop »

Slim 293 wrote:
jdogscoop wrote:Tim Smith is an absolute waste of skin.

But Andrew Bolt has the scoop on how to flatten the curve... for good!

For some reason it involves opening up restaurants. :lol:
How long will the Liberal Party put up with the mouthy shunt?
When asked by 3AW Mornings host Neil Mitchell about whether he agreed with comments made by state Liberal MP Tim Smith on Sydney radio earlier this morning that Premier Daniel Andrews and his ministers had "blood and their hands" and that Mr Andrews should step down, Mr Frydenberg replied with “they’re not words I would use”.

“Daniel Andrews is obviously operating in a very difficult environment,” he said.

“My message to Tim – and everyone else – is to work toward that single objective, to reduce the number of new cases and get the virus under control.”
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CrazyIslander
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by CrazyIslander »

Tim Smith must be a real cvnt if he makes Maxwell sound sensible.
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Thomas
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Thomas »

CrazyIslander wrote:Tim Smith must be a real cvnt if he makes Maxwell sound sensible.
Imagine the worst traits in a politician and then add in simpering private school mannerisms and you have Tim Smith. He is a genuinely horrible person.
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jdogscoop
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by jdogscoop »

Pat the Ex Mat wrote:So there are over 800 cases that are not linked to the Security debacle and are classed as "Unkown"
My understanding is the "unknown" cases don't necessarily exclude the hotel quarantine cases. That got away on them so fast I don't think they've adequately been able to conduct thorough contact tracing.
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jdogscoop
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by jdogscoop »

Thomas wrote:
CrazyIslander wrote:Tim Smith must be a real cvnt if he makes Maxwell sound sensible.
Imagine the worst traits in a politician and then add in simpering private school mannerisms and you have Tim Smith. He is a genuinely horrible person.
I was shocked to learn he was a champion rower in his earlier years. I could not believe he was actually good at something.
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Pat the Ex Mat
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Pat the Ex Mat »

jdogscoop wrote:
Thomas wrote:
CrazyIslander wrote:Tim Smith must be a real cvnt if he makes Maxwell sound sensible.
Imagine the worst traits in a politician and then add in simpering private school mannerisms and you have Tim Smith. He is a genuinely horrible person.
I was shocked to learn he was a champion rower in his earlier years. I could not believe he was actually good at something.
So was Cory Bernardi..... :|
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CrazyIslander
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by CrazyIslander »

Thomas wrote:
CrazyIslander wrote:Tim Smith must be a real cvnt if he makes Maxwell sound sensible.
Imagine the worst traits in a politician and then add in simpering private school mannerisms and you have Tim Smith. He is a genuinely horrible person.
Not gonna bother looking him up if that's the case.
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Clogs
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Clogs »

Farva wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:Any resident Melbourne posters go to work today? Am trying to confirm the rules around work restrictions as it is not clear from the statement by the Premier yesterday and media reports today.

What I have noticed is:
  • Restaurants, cafes and markets are all allowed to trade for takeaways only.

    Hairdressers are still open.

    Butchers, bakers and shopping malls are all still open.
These are already some of the big differences between NZ L4 and Melbourne L4. In NZ none of this was possible.
Its not kicked in yet. There is an announcement today to explain what is and is not allowed.
I doubt that shopping malls or hairdressers will remain open.
I would assume that butchers and bakers will be - they are effectively supermarkets.
You are allowed to buy bread but not cake. You can visit your coffee shop for a take away, but you cannot buy hot chocolate. You can go for a walk with your dogs, but not your children. You are not allowed to leave your post code unless you have a good reason. You must wear a mask, unless you cannot. You are not allowed to marry, but you can die. You can marry if you die.

Clear?
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CrazyIslander
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by CrazyIslander »

Clogs wrote:
Farva wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:Any resident Melbourne posters go to work today? Am trying to confirm the rules around work restrictions as it is not clear from the statement by the Premier yesterday and media reports today.

What I have noticed is:
  • Restaurants, cafes and markets are all allowed to trade for takeaways only.

    Hairdressers are still open.

    Butchers, bakers and shopping malls are all still open.
These are already some of the big differences between NZ L4 and Melbourne L4. In NZ none of this was possible.
Its not kicked in yet. There is an announcement today to explain what is and is not allowed.
I doubt that shopping malls or hairdressers will remain open.
I would assume that butchers and bakers will be - they are effectively supermarkets.
You are allowed to buy bread but not cake. You can visit your coffee shop for a take away, but you cannot buy hot chocolate. You can go for a walk with your dogs, but not your children. You are not allowed to leave your post code unless you have a good reason. You must wear a mask, unless you cannot. You are not allowed to marry, but you can die. You can marry if you die.

Clear?
What about funerals?
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Clogs
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Clogs »

CrazyIslander wrote:
Clogs wrote:
Farva wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:Any resident Melbourne posters go to work today? Am trying to confirm the rules around work restrictions as it is not clear from the statement by the Premier yesterday and media reports today.

What I have noticed is:
  • Restaurants, cafes and markets are all allowed to trade for takeaways only.

    Hairdressers are still open.

    Butchers, bakers and shopping malls are all still open.
These are already some of the big differences between NZ L4 and Melbourne L4. In NZ none of this was possible.
Its not kicked in yet. There is an announcement today to explain what is and is not allowed.
I doubt that shopping malls or hairdressers will remain open.
I would assume that butchers and bakers will be - they are effectively supermarkets.
You are allowed to buy bread but not cake. You can visit your coffee shop for a take away, but you cannot buy hot chocolate. You can go for a walk with your dogs, but not your children. You are not allowed to leave your post code unless you have a good reason. You must wear a mask, unless you cannot. You are not allowed to marry, but you can die. You can marry if you die.

Clear?
What about funerals?

You can have a funeral. But only if you are dead.
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CrazyIslander
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by CrazyIslander »

Clogs wrote:
CrazyIslander wrote:
Clogs wrote:
Farva wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:Any resident Melbourne posters go to work today? Am trying to confirm the rules around work restrictions as it is not clear from the statement by the Premier yesterday and media reports today.

What I have noticed is:
  • Restaurants, cafes and markets are all allowed to trade for takeaways only.

    Hairdressers are still open.

    Butchers, bakers and shopping malls are all still open.
These are already some of the big differences between NZ L4 and Melbourne L4. In NZ none of this was possible.
Its not kicked in yet. There is an announcement today to explain what is and is not allowed.
I doubt that shopping malls or hairdressers will remain open.
I would assume that butchers and bakers will be - they are effectively supermarkets.
You are allowed to buy bread but not cake. You can visit your coffee shop for a take away, but you cannot buy hot chocolate. You can go for a walk with your dogs, but not your children. You are not allowed to leave your post code unless you have a good reason. You must wear a mask, unless you cannot. You are not allowed to marry, but you can die. You can marry if you die.

Clear?
What about funerals?

You can have a funeral. But only if you are dead.
Level 4 is strict like that.
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jdogscoop
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by jdogscoop »

Pretty hard core restrictions just announced.

Most businesses to close temporarily. Emergency trades only allowed.
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Enzedder »

jdogscoop wrote:Pretty hard core restrictions just announced.

Most businesses to close temporarily. Emergency trades only allowed.

Sounds like they are following what we did.
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by jdogscoop »

Enzedder wrote:
jdogscoop wrote:Pretty hard core restrictions just announced.

Most businesses to close temporarily. Emergency trades only allowed.

Sounds like they are following what we did.
Get this Kiwis. The hairdressers are closing!

Hell, it must be bad. Lucky I got a short back and sides last week.
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naki
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by naki »

Hang tough, Melbournitianists. Hope you're out and about again soon.

Scary to think that NZ is just one quarantine-escapee wrongun away from the same thing happening. We could not handle another lockdown.
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Muttonbirds »

jdogscoop wrote:
Enzedder wrote:
jdogscoop wrote:Pretty hard core restrictions just announced.

Most businesses to close temporarily. Emergency trades only allowed.

Sounds like they are following what we did.
Get this Kiwis. The hairdressers are closing!

Hell, it must be bad. Lucky I got a short back and sides last week.
Stuff like this is pretty important. It might not seem so but each restriction lowers risk and heightens compliance.

Studies will be done on this for decades to come.
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Muttonbirds
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Muttonbirds »

Farva wrote:Phase 3 worked in Melbourne too. We were down to single digit case growth.

Restrictions were relaxed and then there was a second outbreak. For some reason it has not worked when implemented again, maybe due to the extent of community transmission, etc.

NZ probably would have worked with phase 3 too. There is an argument that they went too hard. But they are back to normal, so good on them (much like WA, SA, Tas, NT, Qld, etc)
I can't remember the details around when we came out of L4. I'm pretty sure we had zero community, or unknown, transmission for some days.

The idea it was gone from VIC before relaxation is false I think, and the excuse that it was just the hotel quarantine breach and the hotel quarantine breach alone isn't helpful at all because it is highly unlikely to be true and the promotion of that meme further fuels complacency within the community.
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Clogs
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Clogs »

naki wrote:Hang tough, Melbournitianists. Hope you're out and about again soon.

Scary to think that NZ is just one quarantine-escapee wrongun away from the same thing happening. We could not handle another lockdown.

:thumbup:


I think we will be ok, we have the AFL on almost every day now, so that helps a lot.
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naki
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by naki »

Clogs wrote:
naki wrote:Hang tough, Melbournitianists. Hope you're out and about again soon.

Scary to think that NZ is just one quarantine-escapee wrongun away from the same thing happening. We could not handle another lockdown.

:thumbup:


I think we will be ok, we have the AFL on almost every day now, so that helps a lot.
AFL every day? That sounds ... good?
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by jdogscoop »

naki wrote:
Clogs wrote:
naki wrote:Hang tough, Melbournitianists. Hope you're out and about again soon.

Scary to think that NZ is just one quarantine-escapee wrongun away from the same thing happening. We could not handle another lockdown.

:thumbup:


I think we will be ok, we have the AFL on almost every day now, so that helps a lot.
AFL every day? That sounds ... good?
Even the biggest rugbyhead goes native sooner or later.

On the Sainters!
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jdogscoop
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by jdogscoop »

Muttonbirds wrote:
jdogscoop wrote:
Enzedder wrote:
jdogscoop wrote:Pretty hard core restrictions just announced.

Most businesses to close temporarily. Emergency trades only allowed.

Sounds like they are following what we did.
Get this Kiwis. The hairdressers are closing!

Hell, it must be bad. Lucky I got a short back and sides last week.
Stuff like this is pretty important. It might not seem so but each restriction lowers risk and heightens compliance.

Studies will be done on this for decades to come.
Again I'm just gutted that the highly qualified Professor Brett Sutton is Victoria's Chief Health Officer, when for the right price we could have secured the services of Muttonbirds and his various reckons.
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Muttonbirds »

jdogscoop wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:
jdogscoop wrote:
Enzedder wrote:
jdogscoop wrote:Pretty hard core restrictions just announced.

Most businesses to close temporarily. Emergency trades only allowed.

Sounds like they are following what we did.
Get this Kiwis. The hairdressers are closing!

Hell, it must be bad. Lucky I got a short back and sides last week.
Stuff like this is pretty important. It might not seem so but each restriction lowers risk and heightens compliance.

Studies will be done on this for decades to come.
Again I'm just gutted that the highly qualified Professor Brett Sutton is Victoria's Chief Health Officer, when for the right price we could have secured the services of Muttonbirds and his various reckons.
Clearly, Victoria's Chief Health Officer, Professor Brett Sutton has not done a very good job.

Or at least the he, being the architect of the health response, should have pushed much further the first time or for longer.

That cannot be argued.
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by jdogscoop »

Muttonbirds wrote:Clearly, Victoria's Chief Health Officer, Professor Brett Sutton has not done a very good job.
He wasn't responsible for the decision to award the hotel quarantine contracts to private security firms. After all, that is where the second outbreak stemmed from and the reason we have now had to go into a stage 4 lockdown.
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Muttonbirds
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Muttonbirds »

jdogscoop wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:Clearly, Victoria's Chief Health Officer, Professor Brett Sutton has not done a very good job.
He wasn't responsible for the decision to award the hotel quarantine contracts to private security firms. After all, that is where the second outbreak stemmed from and the reason we have now had to go into a stage 4 lockdown.
You keep saying this but it just isn't likely to be true. More likely is there were several undetected pockets in Melbourne and they prematurely rushed to open up. That coupled with a less than adequate initial lockdown.

Seriously, stop promoting the idea that it was one breach at a poorly guarded hotel. You are being conned if you think that.
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Ali's Choice »

Muttonbirds wrote:
jdogscoop wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:Clearly, Victoria's Chief Health Officer, Professor Brett Sutton has not done a very good job.
He wasn't responsible for the decision to award the hotel quarantine contracts to private security firms. After all, that is where the second outbreak stemmed from and the reason we have now had to go into a stage 4 lockdown.
You keep saying this but it just isn't likely to be true. More likely is there were several undetected pockets in Melbourne and they prematurely rushed to open up. That coupled with a less than adequate initial lockdown.

Seriously, stop promoting the idea that it was one breach at a poorly guarded hotel. You are being conned if you think that.
Less than adequate lockdown? QLD had exactly the same lockdown as Victoria did, and our death and infection rates makes NZ look like plague-capital. So the lockdown wasn't the issue. It was infected foreign arrivals coupled with issues with the quarantine procedures.
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Muttonbirds »

Ali's Choice wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:
jdogscoop wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:Clearly, Victoria's Chief Health Officer, Professor Brett Sutton has not done a very good job.
He wasn't responsible for the decision to award the hotel quarantine contracts to private security firms. After all, that is where the second outbreak stemmed from and the reason we have now had to go into a stage 4 lockdown.
You keep saying this but it just isn't likely to be true. More likely is there were several undetected pockets in Melbourne and they prematurely rushed to open up. That coupled with a less than adequate initial lockdown.

Seriously, stop promoting the idea that it was one breach at a poorly guarded hotel. You are being conned if you think that.
Less than adequate lockdown? QLD had exactly the same lockdown as Victoria did, and our death and infection rates makes NZ look like plague-capital. So the lockdown wasn't the issue. It was infected foreign arrivals coupled with issues with the quarantine procedures.
That is trolling, plain and simple. No-one outside Queensland is going to remember their response but health organisations all over the world will be demanding an audience with Ashley Bloomfield and Jacinda Ardern for years to come.
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by jdogscoop »

Muttonbirds wrote:Clearly, Victoria's Chief Health Officer, Professor Brett Sutton has not done a very good job.

Or at least the he, being the architect of the health response, should have pushed much further the first time or for longer.

That cannot be argued.
Why? Stage 3 restrictions have worked everywhere else in Australia and no one could have foreseen the hotel quarantine bungle that early.
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shanky
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by shanky »

Muttonbirds wrote:
jdogscoop wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:Clearly, Victoria's Chief Health Officer, Professor Brett Sutton has not done a very good job.
He wasn't responsible for the decision to award the hotel quarantine contracts to private security firms. After all, that is where the second outbreak stemmed from and the reason we have now had to go into a stage 4 lockdown.
You keep saying this but it just isn't likely to be true. More likely is there were several undetected pockets in Melbourne and they prematurely rushed to open up. That coupled with a less than adequate initial lockdown.

Seriously, stop promoting the idea that it was one breach at a poorly guarded hotel. You are being conned if you think that.
You could keep spouting your self-serving theories, or you could listen to the people at the enquiry
Nearly all coronavirus cases now in Victoria may have link to hotel quarantine, inquiry told
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-n ... quiry-told

:yawn:
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Ali's Choice
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Ali's Choice »

Muttonbirds wrote: That is trolling, plain and simple. No-one outside Queensland is going to remember their response but health organisations all over the world will be demanding an audience with Ashley Bloomfield and Jacinda Ardern for years to come.
That's your opinion. The reality is that the same lockdown procedures that you were trolling Victorian based posters about have been very effective in QLD, which has a bigger population but fewer deaths and fewer infections than all of NZ.
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shanky
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by shanky »

I'm loving MBs faux concern for the welfare of Australians

we all know he's enjoying "watching us burn"
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Muttonbirds »

shanky wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:
jdogscoop wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:Clearly, Victoria's Chief Health Officer, Professor Brett Sutton has not done a very good job.
He wasn't responsible for the decision to award the hotel quarantine contracts to private security firms. After all, that is where the second outbreak stemmed from and the reason we have now had to go into a stage 4 lockdown.
You keep saying this but it just isn't likely to be true. More likely is there were several undetected pockets in Melbourne and they prematurely rushed to open up. That coupled with a less than adequate initial lockdown.

Seriously, stop promoting the idea that it was one breach at a poorly guarded hotel. You are being conned if you think that.
You could keep spouting your self-serving theories, or you could listen to the people at the enquiry
Nearly all coronavirus cases now in Victoria may have link to hotel quarantine, inquiry told
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-n ... quiry-told

:yawn:
There is a large number of nearly, mights and maybes in that article. :yawn:
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Farva »

Ali's Choice wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote: That is trolling, plain and simple. No-one outside Queensland is going to remember their response but health organisations all over the world will be demanding an audience with Ashley Bloomfield and Jacinda Ardern for years to come.
That's your opinion. The reality is that the same lockdown procedures that you were trolling Victorian based posters about have been very effective in QLD, which has a bigger population but fewer deaths and fewer infections than all of NZ.
NZ have clearly over done the lockdown and their economy has suffered for it.
Qld, WA, SA, NT and Tas have achieved the same outcome for less impact.
Vic and NSW also did, until the hotel quarantine fiasco.
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Muttonbirds
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Muttonbirds »

Ali's Choice wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote: That is trolling, plain and simple. No-one outside Queensland is going to remember their response but health organisations all over the world will be demanding an audience with Ashley Bloomfield and Jacinda Ardern for years to come.
That's your opinion. The reality is that the same lockdown procedures that you were trolling Victorian based posters about have been very effective in QLD, which has a bigger population but fewer deaths and fewer infections than all of NZ.
I love how you withdraw further and further into your cupboard under the stairs. It's Queensland against the world. Never mind that Queensland is part of federal Australia.

The schisms that are opening up in Australia are concerning because it shows Australia is not one country battling together. It is splitting politically and socially. You yourself enjoy trolling fellow countrymen and others by regularly posting Queensland stats on this forum, never Australia's though. :roll:
Last edited by Muttonbirds on Mon Aug 03, 2020 8:48 am, edited 1 time in total.
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shanky
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by shanky »

Muttonbirds wrote:
shanky wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:
jdogscoop wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote:Clearly, Victoria's Chief Health Officer, Professor Brett Sutton has not done a very good job.
He wasn't responsible for the decision to award the hotel quarantine contracts to private security firms. After all, that is where the second outbreak stemmed from and the reason we have now had to go into a stage 4 lockdown.
You keep saying this but it just isn't likely to be true. More likely is there were several undetected pockets in Melbourne and they prematurely rushed to open up. That coupled with a less than adequate initial lockdown.

Seriously, stop promoting the idea that it was one breach at a poorly guarded hotel. You are being conned if you think that.
You could keep spouting your self-serving theories, or you could listen to the people at the enquiry
Nearly all coronavirus cases now in Victoria may have link to hotel quarantine, inquiry told
https://www.theguardian.com/australia-n ... quiry-told

:yawn:
There is a large number of nearly, mights and maybes in that article. :yawn:

But of course, you know better than the experts in the enquiry.

:lol:
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Muttonbirds
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Muttonbirds »

Farva wrote:
Ali's Choice wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote: That is trolling, plain and simple. No-one outside Queensland is going to remember their response but health organisations all over the world will be demanding an audience with Ashley Bloomfield and Jacinda Ardern for years to come.
That's your opinion. The reality is that the same lockdown procedures that you were trolling Victorian based posters about have been very effective in QLD, which has a bigger population but fewer deaths and fewer infections than all of NZ.
NZ have clearly over done the lockdown and their economy has suffered for it.
Qld, WA, SA, NT and Tas have achieved the same outcome for less impact.
Vic and NSW also did, until the hotel quarantine fiasco.
I've lost you, Farva. That is a shame. :(

New Zealand is as busy as it has ever been. Yes, we are printing/borrowing money but why would you borrow money when it is cheap?

New Zealand's economy is better off now, and will be no worse off than others in the long term.
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Farva
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Farva »

NZ has bounced back well. However, it went in to a very deep hole for a period there. That has an effect and some businesses went down due to it.
Qld, SA, WA, Tas, NT didnt go as deep, and so had less failures, for the same outcome. They have also all bounced back.
Santa
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Santa »

Farva wrote:
Ali's Choice wrote:
Muttonbirds wrote: That is trolling, plain and simple. No-one outside Queensland is going to remember their response but health organisations all over the world will be demanding an audience with Ashley Bloomfield and Jacinda Ardern for years to come.
That's your opinion. The reality is that the same lockdown procedures that you were trolling Victorian based posters about have been very effective in QLD, which has a bigger population but fewer deaths and fewer infections than all of NZ.
NZ have clearly over done the lockdown and their economy has suffered for it.
Qld, WA, SA, NT and Tas have achieved the same outcome for less impact.
Vic and NSW also did, until the hotel quarantine fiasco.
Agree.
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Re: Melbourne. Fvcked.

Post by Sensible Stephen »

Farva wrote:NZ has bounced back well. However, it went in to a very deep hole for a period there. That has an effect and some businesses went down due to it.
Qld, SA, WA, Tas, NT didnt go as deep, and so had less failures, for the same outcome. They have also all bounced back.
The simple fact is Sydney and Melbourne have much higher international traffic than Auckland. Magnitudes higher.

Melbourne screwed up a couple of hotel isolation's and got done over.

NZ also screwed up a couple of hotel isolation's, but got lucky.

MB waving his dick around is just pure ignorance.
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