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 Post subject: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 12:33 pm 
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How the f*ck is this not front page news?

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/20 ... er-source/


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 12:45 pm 
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WTF? If a fraction of this is true- someone is going to get whacked.

https://thefederalist.com/2020/07/27/fb ... g-buddies/


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 12:49 pm 
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The Washington Times :lol: :lol:
The Federalist :lol: :lol: :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 12:51 pm 
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I for one am shocked that an intelligence source uses a restricted substance such as alcohol.


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 12:54 pm 
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"intelligence" is anything but.

Disinformation is the "intelligence community's" stock in trade


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 12:58 pm 
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The Steele dossier had already been mostly discredited. It was part of the investigation that came out when they looked into the FBI as part of the Carter Page mess that looked at FBI actions unfavorably. When investigators sat and talked to Steele, most of his information didn't stand up to much more credible than internet rumor when they pressed him on it.

That said, it served Democrats and their allies in the media pretty well, which is all they wanted.


Last edited by Flyin Ryan on Wed Jul 29, 2020 1:00 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 12:58 pm 
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EverReady wrote:
The Washington Times :lol: :lol:
The Federalist :lol: :lol: :lol:



Like I said, why is this not front page news? The underlying facts are very concerning and ....crickets.

P.s if you don't belive me, take it from him.

https://twitter.com/afneil/status/1288426212667383809


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 1:02 pm 
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Flyin Ryan wrote:
The Steele dossier had already been mostly discredited. It was part of the investigation that came out when they looked into the FBI as part of the Carter Page mess that looked at FBI actions unfavorably. When investigators sat and talked to Steele, most of his information didn't stand up to much more credible than internet rumor when they pressed him on it.



Sure... But I don't think people knew quite how flaky it was or or about the linkage to the Brookings Institute and to Talbott and Hill.


Last edited by zzzz on Wed Jul 29, 2020 1:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 1:02 pm 
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robmatic wrote:
I for one am shocked that an intelligence source uses a restricted substance such as alcohol.



You have an unerring eye for picking out the important part of a story.


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 1:04 pm 
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EverReady wrote:
The Washington Times :lol: :lol:
The Federalist :lol: :lol: :lol:


:lol:
Exactly what I thought. Wonder what Zerohedge has to say about all this?


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 1:05 pm 
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zzzz wrote:
Flyin Ryan wrote:
The Steele dossier had already been mostly discredited. It was part of the investigation that came out when they looked into the FBI as part of the Carter Page mess that looked at FBI actions unfavorably. When investigators sat and talked to Steele, most of his information didn't stand up to much more credible than internet rumor when they pressed him on it.


Sure.. But I don't think people new quite how flaky it was or or about the linkage to the Brookings Institute and to Talbott and Hill.


Well as a person thst listens to the Lawfare podcast that Brookings publishes, their next episode should be fun. :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 1:07 pm 
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Might be a good thread to review a few things that have been said about Steele and the dossier over the past few years.

6.Jones wrote:
Santa wrote:
Steele still on it I see. Good commitment. :thumbup:

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/ ... ele-claims

It's a shame they didn't realise he was a fabulist when he ran the Russia desk at MI6.


Yes. Yes it is a shame.


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 1:11 pm 
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Kiwias wrote:
Just as well the FISA warrant was not based on the Steele report


:?


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 1:14 pm 
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Turbogoat wrote:
It's pretty damn tragic for anyone to still be clutching their pearls about the Steele Dossier really.
The reason the FBI took any notice of it was because it reiterated what they already knew about much of what was going on. If there was any doubt about the ability of the FBI and intel services to break down what was going on then a quick look at the recent indictments of specific Russian intel officers for their very detailed actions in interfering with the US elections should have been a good indicator that they know faaar more than just what Buzzfeed publishes.
And why is the Steele dossier getting so much grief in the first place? Because the handwringers are attempting to use it to insinuate that the investigation was just partisan hackery instigated by the evil Democrats. If there is an actual prosecution of anyone, and the only "evidence" that is brought forward is the Steele Dossier, then yes, I'll agree with them, it's not nearly enough to convict anyone on its own. It's just a series of memos regarding interviews with Russian officials by a third party. It's not enough to convict. Hell, it's interesting, it's salacious, and been shown to be surprisingly accurate in many parts, but it's secondhand info that is often 'single source' which is not a lot to go on, on its own. But it's not being used as the sole piece of evidence in a prosecution though is it. It was yet another source for other multi-sourced pieces of intel that the FBI already had and was yet another piece of confirmation. The Republican Judges who repeatedly approved the FISA warrants saw all the other intel and confirmed there was enough for more rigorous investigation. Not conviction (yet) - investigation.

But the info the dossier contained was cause for concern. In fact, it was so concerning that when Steele put it together, what did he do? He took it the FBI, like anyone not antagonistic toward the USA should have done. (Note to Don Jr etc... when foreign agents contact you with possible illegal activity reports or offers of illegally gained intel, this is what you're supposed to do)

The FBI had been very interested in Carter Page (and others)for a long time prior to the Steele Dossier ever becoming a thing. They already had a lot of intel well before the boogeyman Steele crawled out from under the bed. Steele was a latecomer to this.

And all this is just what has become public knowledge. The amount of redacted info in the FISA warrants shows that there is a LOT more intel out there. Even without knowing the content, the sheer amount is staggering. To ignore that and focus on the one publicly released section and assume that this is the heart and soul of it all, just because that's the only part you are aware of is pure arrogance.

One day we may know the full story. It'll certainly be 'interesting'.


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 1:17 pm 
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Flyin Ryan wrote:
zzzz wrote:
Flyin Ryan wrote:
The Steele dossier had already been mostly discredited. It was part of the investigation that came out when they looked into the FBI as part of the Carter Page mess that looked at FBI actions unfavorably. When investigators sat and talked to Steele, most of his information didn't stand up to much more credible than internet rumor when they pressed him on it.


Sure.. But I don't think people new quite how flaky it was or or about the linkage to the Brookings Institute and to Talbott and Hill.


Well as a person thst listens to the Lawfare podcast that Brookings publishes, their next episode should be fun. :lol:


Lawfare hasn't mentioned anything about this, and they're usually all up the asshole of any little tidbit, and Wittes has been conspicuously silent.


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 1:18 pm 
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Rinkals wrote:
I think the Steele dossier has been acknowledged as reasonably accurate.

What has probably undermined it is the salacious detail of hookers urinating on beds because it starts to read like tawdry fiction, but I suspect that sort of action is very much in keeping with how this President operates.


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 1:20 pm 
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Kiwias wrote:
Yer Man wrote:
Kiwias wrote:
A former U.S. attorney and a Harvard Law student teamed up to revisit the Steele dossier by cross-referencing it with special counsel Robert Mueller’s findings — and unveiled which parts of it hold water.

https://www.lawfareblog.com/steele-doss ... rospective

If you're looking for a one line summary:

"The dossier holds up well over time, and none of it, to our knowledge, has been disproven."


Damn you. :x :x I wanted to make Santa and WT read every line to find some way of dismissing it.


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 2:10 pm 
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zzzz wrote:
EverReady wrote:
The Washington Times :lol: :lol:
The Federalist :lol: :lol: :lol:



Like I said, why is this not front page news? The underlying facts are very concerning and ....crickets.

P.s if you don't belive me, take it from him.

https://twitter.com/afneil/status/1288426212667383809

Why is this not front page news?

Quote:
a Russian national whose past includes criminal convictions and other personal baggage ignored by the FBI in vetting him and the information he fed to Steele, /quote]
I'd wager they're used to that. I'd go further the below probably describes +50% of their CIs
Quote:
was arrested, jailed and convicted years earlier on multiple public drunkenness and disorderly conduct charges in the Washington area and ordered to undergo substance-abuse and mental-health counseling, according to criminal records.

The Steele dossier was always dodgy but as far as how the FBI operate it's not off the reservation. And that is why it's not front page news.

Also
Quote:
according to congressional sources and records obtained by RealClearInvestigations.[

So you know it's good.

I mean fucking hell.
Quote:
In an odd twist, a 2013 federal case against Danchenko was prosecuted by then-U.S Attorney Rod Rosenstein, who ended up signing one of the FBI’s dossier-based wiretap warrants as deputy attorney general in 2017.

He was the DA in the district where he was prosecuted.


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 2:21 pm 
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The Washington Post on the Steel Dossier.

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=th ... &FORM=VIRE


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 2:22 pm 
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Rachel Maddow

https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=th ... ORM=VDRVRV


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 2:25 pm 
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Ooooh, the Steele Dossier "played a central and essential role in the decision to seek a FISA order".

https://video.foxnews.com/v/6114984024001#sp=show-clips

Turbogoat wrote:
Santa wrote:
The surveillance on Carter Page that relied on the Steele dossier.


That's a brave stance to take considering how much of the FISA application was redacted.
https://int.nyt.com/data/documenthelper ... imized.pdf

I'm sure there's nothing important at all under all that blackness though. ;)


Yes. It was brave and it was right. 8)

Turbogoat wrote:
NO. The Steele dossier was what brought public attention to a lot of it, and you've overstated the actual impact of the Steele dossier repeatedly, especially when you call it 'fundamental' to securing the FISA warrant. You've been informed of the grave error of this before, yet you continue to repeat this in the hope that it will make it true.

Papadopolous getting drunk and bragging to an Australian diplomat about the shenanigans going on was what 'launched' all of this, and the screeds of evidence that bagged the FISA warrants, and then more that ensured the repeated renewal of those warrants every 90 days were what convinced those Republican nominated Judges to repeatedly renew the warrants. The only reason the Steele dossier got any attention at all was because Buzzfeed published it and drew all this into the public eye.
But you have been told all this before, and you know it.


Did I? Did I overstate the actual impact of the Steele Dossier, especially when I called it 'fundamental' to securing the FISA warrant? I'm not so sure that I did.


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 2:53 pm 
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Santa wrote:
Turbogoat wrote:
It's pretty damn tragic for anyone to still be clutching their pearls about the Steele Dossier really.
The reason the FBI took any notice of it was because it reiterated what they already knew about much of what was going on. If there was any doubt about the ability of the FBI and intel services to break down what was going on then a quick look at the recent indictments of specific Russian intel officers for their very detailed actions in interfering with the US elections should have been a good indicator that they know faaar more than just what Buzzfeed publishes.
And why is the Steele dossier getting so much grief in the first place? Because the handwringers are attempting to use it to insinuate that the investigation was just partisan hackery instigated by the evil Democrats. If there is an actual prosecution of anyone, and the only "evidence" that is brought forward is the Steele Dossier, then yes, I'll agree with them, it's not nearly enough to convict anyone on its own. It's just a series of memos regarding interviews with Russian officials by a third party. It's not enough to convict. Hell, it's interesting, it's salacious, and been shown to be surprisingly accurate in many parts, but it's secondhand info that is often 'single source' which is not a lot to go on, on its own. But it's not being used as the sole piece of evidence in a prosecution though is it. It was yet another source for other multi-sourced pieces of intel that the FBI already had and was yet another piece of confirmation. The Republican Judges who repeatedly approved the FISA warrants saw all the other intel and confirmed there was enough for more rigorous investigation. Not conviction (yet) - investigation.

But the info the dossier contained was cause for concern. In fact, it was so concerning that when Steele put it together, what did he do? He took it the FBI, like anyone not antagonistic toward the USA should have done. (Note to Don Jr etc... when foreign agents contact you with possible illegal activity reports or offers of illegally gained intel, this is what you're supposed to do)

The FBI had been very interested in Carter Page (and others)for a long time prior to the Steele Dossier ever becoming a thing. They already had a lot of intel well before the boogeyman Steele crawled out from under the bed. Steele was a latecomer to this.

And all this is just what has become public knowledge. The amount of redacted info in the FISA warrants shows that there is a LOT more intel out there. Even without knowing the content, the sheer amount is staggering. To ignore that and focus on the one publicly released section and assume that this is the heart and soul of it all, just because that's the only part you are aware of is pure arrogance.

One day we may know the full story. It'll certainly be 'interesting'.


I think this post says more about you than it does about him.
Who does this?

Did you actually ever play rugby? Genuine question

x(


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 3:09 pm 
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Quote:
The Steele dossier was always dodgy but as far as how the FBI operate it's not off the reservation. And that is why it's not front page news.


The Steele dossier was outwith even the usual FBI practices (which I agree are lousy) and equally there was nothing normal about the investigation it was used in. I think this whole thing has gone on so long people forget how literally inconceivable it once was that the FBI would run surveliance on a presidential campaign. The combination of appaling practice and politically charged investigation should make any updates big news. And there is new stuff in this - linking in more Clinton actors and making it clear this was just boozy bullshit concocted in bars inside the Beltway and f-all to do with Russian sources.

Quote:
So you know it's good.

I mean f**king hell.


So ongressional records become inaccurate when RealClear obtain them?


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 3:09 pm 
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As a general rule, if you want to know why any story is not being more widely pursued, it's because it is, at least the way that the fringe "news" source is presenting it, a giant pile of bullshit!

Doesn't matter if you are seeking left leaning news sources, right leaning news sources, or if you are in fact actually a sensible human being, this holds true in almost every instance.

You're welcome!


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 3:11 pm 
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PornDog wrote:
As a general rule, if you want to know why any story is not being more widely pursued, it's because it is, at least the way that the fringe "news" source is presenting it, a giant pile of bullshit!

Doesn't matter if you are seeking left leaning news sources, right leaning news sources, or if you are in fact actually a sensible human being, this holds true in almost every instance.

You're welcome!


The Brookings link was fairly widely reported a few days ago. The new information is the actual name of the sub-source.

Mind you, taking the inverse of your proposition, which is bollocks by the way, should we infer from wide reporting that the story isn't bullshit? Because given the amount of reporting it received Steele should have been the truest thing in the universe, and only the fringe media maintained that it was a giant pile of bullshit.


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 3:18 pm 
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zzzz wrote:
Quote:
The Steele dossier was always dodgy but as far as how the FBI operate it's not off the reservation. And that is why it's not front page news.


The Steele dossier was outwith even the usual FBI practices (which I agree are lousy) and equally there was nothing normal about the investigation it was used in. I think this whole thing has gone on so long people forget how literally inconceivable it once was that the FBI would run surveliance on a presidential campaign. The combination of appaling practice and politically charged investigation should make any updates big news. And there is new stuff in this - linking in more Clinton actors and making it clear this was just boozy bullshit concocted in bars inside the Beltway and f-all to do with Russian sources.

Quote:
So you know it's good.

I mean f**king hell.


So ongressional records become inaccurate when RealClear obtain them?


Oh FFS, spare us your pearl-clutching histrionics. The FBI literally cut its teeth as an instrument of political whim and favour.
There’s no doubt Obama’s FBI was bent, just like there’s no doubt Trump’s Park Police are now too.

Colour me shocked. :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 3:38 pm 
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zzzz wrote:
Quote:
The Steele dossier was always dodgy but as far as how the FBI operate it's not off the reservation. And that is why it's not front page news.


The Steele dossier was outwith even the usual FBI practices (which I agree are lousy) and equally there was nothing normal about the investigation it was used in. I think this whole thing has gone on so long people forget how literally inconceivable it once was that the FBI would run surveliance on a presidential campaign. The combination of appaling practice and politically charged investigation should make any updates big news. And there is new stuff in this - linking in more Clinton actors and making it clear this was just boozy bullshit concocted in bars inside the Beltway and f-all to do with Russian sources.

Quote:
So you know it's good.

I mean f**king hell.


So ongressional records become inaccurate when RealClear obtain them?

No it's entirely usual for the FBI(even what they did to Flynn was text book) the investigation itself wasn't. But you think someone with addiction and drink issues being used as an informant is scandalous so idk.And no it's not the first time there's been an investigation into a presidential campaign.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1996_United_States_campaign_finance_controversy

Clinton? JFC.Playin the hits!


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 3:47 pm 
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paddyor wrote:
zzzz wrote:
Quote:
The Steele dossier was always dodgy but as far as how the FBI operate it's not off the reservation. And that is why it's not front page news.


The Steele dossier was outwith even the usual FBI practices (which I agree are lousy) and equally there was nothing normal about the investigation it was used in. I think this whole thing has gone on so long people forget how literally inconceivable it once was that the FBI would run surveliance on a presidential campaign. The combination of appaling practice and politically charged investigation should make any updates big news. And there is new stuff in this - linking in more Clinton actors and making it clear this was just boozy bullshit concocted in bars inside the Beltway and f-all to do with Russian sources.

Quote:
So you know it's good.

I mean f**king hell.


So ongressional records become inaccurate when RealClear obtain them?

No it's entirely usual for the FBI(even what they did to Flynn was text book) the investigation itself wasn't. But you think someone with addiction and drink issues being used as an informant is scandalous so idk.And no it's not the first time there's been an investigation into a presidential campaign.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1996_United_States_campaign_finance_controversy

Clinton? JFC.Playin the hits!


Yeah. I suspect the problem is not simply that they had a dodgy informant, which is surely pretty common. It's more that dodgy information from a dodgy informant was used in the way it was, to the extent that it was, and in the investigation that it was, without any kind of robust verification, which includes assessing the dodgy informant's dodginess.

As I have said before, you would think that if there is one investigation where you would try to do all the right things it would be investigating a political opponent. Not only did they not even try to do all the right things, they actually tried to do some of the wrong things.

And that's ignoring all of the intersection relationships between anti-Trump types.


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:01 pm 
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Hilarious

Immediately prior to the Trump transition, the (aargh) MSM was full of stories about how the Obama administration was attempting to farm out or release the results of so-called ‘investigations’ into Trump (aka ‘leak’) because the published ‘fear’ was that Trump would ‘cover up’ or hide it.

Right there, in the ‘MSM’....You could google it even.

I guess, if you were interested.

:lol: :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:04 pm 
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Santa wrote:
Yeah. I suspect the problem is not simply that they had a dodgy informant, which is surely pretty common. It's more that dodgy information from a dodgy informant was used in the way it was, to the extent that it was, and in the investigation that it was, without any kind of robust verification, which includes assessing the dodgy informant's dodginess.

As I have said before, you would think that if there is one investigation where you would try to do all the right things it would be investigating a political opponent. Not only did they not even try to do all the right things, they actually tried to do some of the wrong things.

And that's ignoring all of the intersection relationships between anti-Trump types.

When one dodgy won't do use 3! Santa rates the FBIs conduct 3 Del boys!

The FBI is never wrong though. They have huge discretion in what they do and that's why no one's been charged with wrong doing.


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:05 pm 
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paddyor wrote:
Santa wrote:
Yeah. I suspect the problem is not simply that they had a dodgy informant, which is surely pretty common. It's more that dodgy information from a dodgy informant was used in the way it was, to the extent that it was, and in the investigation that it was, without any kind of robust verification, which includes assessing the dodgy informant's dodginess.

As I have said before, you would think that if there is one investigation where you would try to do all the right things it would be investigating a political opponent. Not only did they not even try to do all the right things, they actually tried to do some of the wrong things.

And that's ignoring all of the intersection relationships between anti-Trump types.

When one dodgy won't do use 3! Santa rates the FBIs conduct 3 Del boys!

The FBI is never wrong though. They have huge discretion in what they do and that's why no one's been charged with wrong doing.


I guess we'll await Durham on that last point. No idea what you're talking about in the first.


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:08 pm 
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So spaketh the Associate Professer of central southern Otago technical college, innit.


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:11 pm 
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Quote:
“Igor Danchenko has been identified as one of the sources who provided data and analysis,” he said.


And?

Forgive me if I'm unimpressed. Is this meant to be some kind of disproof?


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:12 pm 
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6.Jones wrote:
Quote:
“Igor Danchenko has been identified as one of the sources who provided data and analysis,” he said.


And?

Forgive me if I'm unimpressed. Is this meant to be some kind of disproof?


Good man. Never give up. :thumbup:


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:15 pm 
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And you expect credibility for your pop-history NZ cultural insights

It’s like Mick Dundee, with a degree. :lol:


Last edited by shanky on Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:16 pm 
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6.Jones wrote:
Quote:
“Igor Danchenko has been identified as one of the sources who provided data and analysis,” he said.


And?

Forgive me if I'm unimpressed. Is this meant to be some kind of disproof?



Disproof of what?


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:19 pm 
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Meh.


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:20 pm 
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6.Jones wrote:
Meh.


Is that a Socratian disproof of idiocy?


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:21 pm 
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shanky wrote:
6.Jones wrote:
Meh.


Is that a Socratian disproof of idiocy?

I've never even been to Socratia.


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 Post subject: Re: Steele Dossier
PostPosted: Wed Jul 29, 2020 4:23 pm 
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6.Jones wrote:
shanky wrote:
6.Jones wrote:
Meh.


Is that a Socratian disproof of idiocy?

I've never even been to Socratia.


I’ve heard it’s nice. In the Covfefe Archipelego


:lol:


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