Your most embarrassing oversight of an international player

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mr bungle
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by mr bungle »

Mog The Almighty wrote:I copped a lot of shit for saying Tupou was the best scrummager in Australia a while back. Of course it's situation normal for know-nothings to heap shit in this place and then fail to even have the dignity to wipe the egg off their face when it becomes obvious.
It beggars belief that anyone would question your knowledge come scrum time.
Sonny Blount
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by Sonny Blount »

When I first saw Jordie Barrett I thought he was an ordinary out of position player who was too weak to play lock.

It probably took until his performance at 10 for the Lions against the Lions for me to see the All Black great he was going to tbecome.
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naki
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by naki »

Sonny Blount wrote:When I first saw Jordie Barrett I thought he was an ordinary out of position player who was too weak to play lock.

It probably took until his performance at 10 for the Lions against the Lions for me to see the All Black great he was going to tbecome.
When's he going to get there?
Wilderbeast
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by Wilderbeast »

2022.
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Jerome Manning
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by Jerome Manning »

Dane Coles is a great call. I don't think anyone except his mother rated him early on. The first time I saw him in an NPC game he genuinely looked like an undersized 15 year old. He then went on to be the best hooker in the world in the space of about 15 minutes. It was like "eerrr, wtf did this come from?".
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eldanielfire
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by eldanielfire »

LandOTurk wrote:A bunch of Welsh on this forum repeatedly said Liam Williams was not international standard. Practically none of them admit it now.
I think it was more his brain and brainfarts would restrict his international success.
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Shrekles
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by Shrekles »

Mog The Almighty wrote:I copped a lot of shit for saying Tupou was the best scrummager in Australia a while back. Of course it's situation normal for know-nothings to heap shit in this place and then fail to even have the dignity to wipe the egg off their face when it becomes obvious.
I think it was more a case of everybody laughing because you are correct - he is the best scrummager.... in Australia...
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chicharino
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by chicharino »

International 7's Perry Baker, reckoned he was a flash (pun intended) in the pan. Been pretty prolific.
15's: Given what a beast Samu Monoa was as a pro, I reckon he never had much of an impact with us internationally..
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UncleFB
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by UncleFB »

naki wrote:
Sonny Blount wrote:When I first saw Jordie Barrett I thought he was an ordinary out of position player who was too weak to play lock.

It probably took until his performance at 10 for the Lions against the Lions for me to see the All Black great he was going to tbecome.
When's he going to get there?
:lol: I think Sonny posted in the wrong embarrassing thread.

This is the one you want Sonny:
viewtopic.php?f=3&t=99841
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Kiwias
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by Kiwias »

I was massively under-impressed with Pole Whiting in his first couple of years but he proved to be a genuine star.
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LandOTurk
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by LandOTurk »

eldanielfire wrote:
LandOTurk wrote:A bunch of Welsh on this forum repeatedly said Liam Williams was not international standard. Practically none of them admit it now.
I think it was more his brain and brainfarts would restrict his international success.
Bollox. He was called a dirt tracker. No more than a useful clubman. A thug and not much else. To name a few. I always remember what is said about a Scarlet. Protecting my own.
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mr bungle
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by mr bungle »

Jerome Manning wrote:Dane Coles is a great call. I don't think anyone except his mother rated him early on. The first time I saw him in an NPC game he genuinely looked like an undersized 15 year old. He then went on to be the best hooker in the world in the space of about 15 minutes. It was like "eerrr, wtf did this come from?".
Dane Coles is definitely one who came to mind. Ended up the premier hooker in world rugby and the best of the last decade. Marx would love just a hint of Coles consistency.

The other for me was Corey Jane. I just didn't get him early on. Not many of us did, save for Deadduck.
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AND-y
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by AND-y »

I was in the "why the hell are we playing a backrow forward at 9" camp when it came to Mike Phillips.

Thought Stephen Jones was a club level plodder for to long.
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by BlueThunder »

Ben Smith had a shit debut.
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MrJonno
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by MrJonno »

I was at one of POCs early internationals in LR and Ireland were quite handily beaten (can't remember who they were playing). I'm a glass half full kinda guy and looking for the silver lining confidently announced to my mates "one good thing is at least that's the last time we'll see that big donkey in green"
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Jim Lahey
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by Jim Lahey »

mr bungle wrote:
Jerome Manning wrote:Dane Coles is a great call. I don't think anyone except his mother rated him early on. The first time I saw him in an NPC game he genuinely looked like an undersized 15 year old. He then went on to be the best hooker in the world in the space of about 15 minutes. It was like "eerrr, wtf did this come from?".
Dane Coles is definitely one who came to mind. Ended up the premier hooker in world rugby and the best of the last decade. Marx would love just a hint of Coles consistency.

The other for me was Corey Jane. I just didn't get him early on. Not many of us did, save for Deadduck.
Likewise with Corey Jane, thought he was shite initially.
I’m thinking along the same lines for that dreadlocked winger for the Highlanders, Gregory I think? Looks a bit shit but commentators seem to talk him up. No doubt he’ll win several world player of the year awards.
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by jdogscoop »

Grandpa wrote:
Ali's Choice wrote:Sam Cane: I never liked him when he first burst onto the scene. Partly because he was a bench player for the Chiefs but seemed to have a guaranteed place in the AB match day 23. I just assumed he was Steve Hansen's personal cabana boy/private dancer. But I'll concede now that he is a decent, test standard flanker.
To be fair.... the longer time goes on, the more I hope a decent number 7 comes along to put Cane out off his misery.... maybe it's the McCaw legacy blurring my glasses... but Sam just feels average to me... yes, I would have preferred him to Scott Barrett in the WC Semi... but I would have preferred any flanker rather than a lock in the biggest game in 4 years...

Sam Cane is a bit like Taine Randell was... you were sorta waiting for the "Ah ha..." moment... that never came...
I think people who don't rate Cane simply don't pay much attention.

He's not much of a ball runner, granted, which is the root of the problem for your average fairweather sailor.

His skill lies in stopping attacks stone cold dead in their tracks. He buries people.

He can also win turnover ball. Kinda critical in an openside.
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by C69 »

eldanielfire wrote:
LandOTurk wrote:A bunch of Welsh on this forum repeatedly said Liam Williams was not international standard. Practically none of them admit it now.
I think it was more his brain and brainfarts would restrict his international success.
Oxymoronically I resemble these posts.
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by Nolanator »

AND-y wrote:I was in the "why the hell are we playing a backrow forward at 9" camp when it came to Mike Phillips.
Good call, actually. I wasn't as aware of Welsh rugby back then and didn't have a strong opinion, but early Philips when compared Peel (who was electric then) seemed like a big guy who wasn't cut out for the back row, or have the mobility for the backs.
Then he got good for years.
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by C69 »

Adam Jones was so spectaculary unfit when he firstvplayed international rugby, in one game Iirc he was blowing so hard he was replaced just after 30mins.....

The rest is history, stuff that legends are told of, passed down the ages.
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by iarmhiman »

Adam Jones best game was that 2nd lions test in Pretoria 2009. He destroyed the Beast who destroyed Vickery a week earlier.
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by C69 »

iarmhiman wrote:Adam Jones best game was that 2nd lions test in Pretoria 2009. He destroyed the Beast who destroyed Vickery a week earlier.
Indeed he was excellent why he did not start the match was a mystery the minute Vickerywent off the whole complection of the game changed. The Beastvwas tamed. His destruction of the English front row in the 2013 30-3 Grand Slam match was also sweet.

God Bless Steve Walsh
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JoeMangled
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by JoeMangled »

Big Dev. Sorry m8.
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Flametop
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by Flametop »

JoeMangled wrote:Big Dev. Sorry m8.
I think Dev probably earned a spot in this thread and also in the other “embarrassing oversight” one.

He was never going to be as good as his fan boys hyped but he worked hard on his deficiencies, fixed a few technicalities, became more physical and played some damn good rugby, all the while preventing a few windows in the Aviva’s corporate boxes from being smashed.
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by Frodder »

LandOTurk wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
LandOTurk wrote:A bunch of Welsh on this forum repeatedly said Liam Williams was not international standard. Practically none of them admit it now.
I think it was more his brain and brainfarts would restrict his international success.
Bollox. He was called a dirt tracker. No more than a useful clubman. A thug and not much else. To name a few. I always remember what is said about a Scarlet. Protecting my own.
One poster's name began with H and ended with enry
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UncleFB
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by UncleFB »

BlueThunder wrote:Ben Smith had a shit debut.
I think when he was first selected most of NZ went who the hell is that? And then the others went is that Ben Smith from BoP?
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by He Man Rugger Pints »

Andrew Trimble, think probably because he came through so young and so raw. Just took a few seasons for the rest of his game to round out and he turned out a fantastic player for Ireland. Devin Toner probably as well.
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Tehui
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by Tehui »

booji boy wrote:
JB1981 wrote:On behalf of Josh Kronfeld who I assume doesn’t post here. This on a young Richie McCaw’s selection:
England-based Kronfeld said after the team were named that All Black jerseys were being handed out too easily.

"It seems incredible to me that they so easily can put No 7s in ... now they've got a guy off one NPC season," said Kronfeld, once regarded as the world's best openside flanker.
Tbf to Kronfeld he put in years of toil for Otago before he was picked for the AB's. His performance for Otago versus the 1993 Lions was superb but he still didn't make the AB's until 1995.
I don't remember Kronfeld turning out for Otago back in 93. Who were the AB openside flankers in the 93 & 94 seasons? I know it wasn't Monkley. I'm guessing it was Brewer and / or Michael Jones?
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by CrazyIslander »

Tehui wrote:
booji boy wrote:
JB1981 wrote:On behalf of Josh Kronfeld who I assume doesn’t post here. This on a young Richie McCaw’s selection:
England-based Kronfeld said after the team were named that All Black jerseys were being handed out too easily.

"It seems incredible to me that they so easily can put No 7s in ... now they've got a guy off one NPC season," said Kronfeld, once regarded as the world's best openside flanker.
Tbf to Kronfeld he put in years of toil for Otago before he was picked for the AB's. His performance for Otago versus the 1993 Lions was superb but he still didn't make the AB's until 1995.
I don't remember Kronfeld turning out for Otago back in 93. Who were the AB openside flankers in the 93 & 94 seasons? I know it wasn't Monkley. I'm guessing it was Brewer and / or Michael Jones?
Don't tell me you've forgotten Mark Carter?
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CrazyIslander
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by CrazyIslander »

I think Paul Henderson got a run as well.
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Tehui
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by Tehui »

CrazyIslander wrote:
Tehui wrote:
booji boy wrote:
JB1981 wrote:On behalf of Josh Kronfeld who I assume doesn’t post here. This on a young Richie McCaw’s selection:
England-based Kronfeld said after the team were named that All Black jerseys were being handed out too easily.

"It seems incredible to me that they so easily can put No 7s in ... now they've got a guy off one NPC season," said Kronfeld, once regarded as the world's best openside flanker.
Tbf to Kronfeld he put in years of toil for Otago before he was picked for the AB's. His performance for Otago versus the 1993 Lions was superb but he still didn't make the AB's until 1995.
I don't remember Kronfeld turning out for Otago back in 93. Who were the AB openside flankers in the 93 & 94 seasons? I know it wasn't Monkley. I'm guessing it was Brewer and / or Michael Jones?
Don't tell me you've forgotten Mark Carter?
I remember him well. But I thought his peak was in the 96-97 period.

Now that I've given it more thought, I'm sure Michael Jones was the openside flanker during the 93 Lions series.
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CrazyIslander
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by CrazyIslander »

Kronfield was 7 in 96,/97
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Tehui
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by Tehui »

CrazyIslander wrote:Kronfield was 7 in 96,/97
I'm not saying Carter was the #1 flanker during 96/97, just that he was at his peak then. The reason I remember it, is because he was incredibly disliked by Otago fans, who perceived Carter as looking better than he was because he played behind a rock star Auckland / AB forward pack.

If memory serves correct, Kronfeld came on to the AB scene in 95 during the same period that Mehrtens and Lomu established themselves as being the guys for the ABs.
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mr bungle
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by mr bungle »

UncleFB wrote:
BlueThunder wrote:Ben Smith had a shit debut.
I think when he was first selected most of NZ went who the hell is that? And then the others went is that Ben Smith from BoP?
Who was also the Ben Smith from Otago who also played for Southland?
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eldanielfire
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by eldanielfire »

LandOTurk wrote:
eldanielfire wrote:
LandOTurk wrote:A bunch of Welsh on this forum repeatedly said Liam Williams was not international standard. Practically none of them admit it now.
I think it was more his brain and brainfarts would restrict his international success.
Bollox. He was called a dirt tracker. No more than a useful clubman. A thug and not much else. To name a few. I always remember what is said about a Scarlet. Protecting my own.
Perhaps, but also the brainfarts against South Africa and other games as he broke into the team.
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eldanielfire
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by eldanielfire »

Bimboc69 wrote:
iarmhiman wrote:Adam Jones best game was that 2nd lions test in Pretoria 2009. He destroyed the Beast who destroyed Vickery a week earlier.
Indeed he was excellent why he did not start the match was a mystery the minute Vickerywent off the whole complection of the game changed. The Beastvwas tamed. His destruction of the English front row in the 2013 30-3 Grand Slam match was also sweet.

God Bless Steve Walsh
It'd amazing what Gatland brought into the Welsh camp with his professional standards. He utterly raised the games and status of Adam Jones, Mike Phillips, Byrne, Shane Williams, Jamie Roberts, Jon Davies, etc into world class players rather than occasionally good.
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I Am Munch
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by I Am Munch »

Kinda related, but I always found it jarring how much Stuart Barnes dismissed the Honey Badger. Even to the extent that he belched and "Oh no!" when he scored.
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by booji boy »

Tehui wrote:
booji boy wrote:
JB1981 wrote:On behalf of Josh Kronfeld who I assume doesn’t post here. This on a young Richie McCaw’s selection:
England-based Kronfeld said after the team were named that All Black jerseys were being handed out too easily.

"It seems incredible to me that they so easily can put No 7s in ... now they've got a guy off one NPC season," said Kronfeld, once regarded as the world's best openside flanker.
Tbf to Kronfeld he put in years of toil for Otago before he was picked for the AB's. His performance for Otago versus the 1993 Lions was superb but he still didn't make the AB's until 1995.
I don't remember Kronfeld turning out for Otago back in 93. Who were the AB openside flankers in the 93 & 94 seasons? I know it wasn't Monkley. I'm guessing it was Brewer and / or Michael Jones?
Michael Jones was definitely the incumbent. Paul Henderson might have played a few tests and I think even Zinzan Brooke might have played the odd game at 7 as Arran Pene was No.8.

Re Mark Carter I think he is best remembered for playing in the 1991 RWC and missing a tackle on Michael Lynagh that lead to a Wallaby try. He was only playing because of Jones refusal to play on Sunday. Nobody south of the Bombay Hills rated him.
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booji boy
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by booji boy »

eldanielfire wrote: It'd amazing what Gatland brought into the Welsh camp with his professional standards. He utterly raised the games and status of Adam Jones, Mike Phillips, Byrne, Shane Williams, Jamie Roberts, Jon Davies, etc into world class players rather than occasionally good.
It's amazing what Warren Gatland has brought into the Waikato Chiefs camp. He has turned them from mostly good but occasionally shite into consistently shite.
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Re: Your most embarrassing oversight of an international pla

Post by Bogbunny »

Deccie Fitz

Big fat lump with concrete hands and acceleration.

Came good in his biggest ever game against the Blackness. :thumbup:
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