**OFFICIAL** English Rugby Thread

mr flaps · Post by **mr flaps** » Sun Feb 03, 2013 3:19 pm

For the first time in a long time i think there is real pressure on the starters to perform because of the depth. The Hask and Lawes went ballistic when they came on.

openclashXX · Post by **openclashXX** » Sun Feb 03, 2013 3:20 pm

Official RFU ‏@Official_RFU

Back row @tomwood678 was in typically abrasive form v Scotland, making most tackles (16) and hitting a huge 45 breakdowns #workrate #stats

geordie_6 · Post by **geordie_6** » Sun Feb 03, 2013 3:21 pm

openclashXX wrote:Official RFU ‏@Official_RFU

Back row @tomwood678 was in typically abrasive form v Scotland, making most tackles (16) and hitting a huge 45 breakdowns #workrate #stats

The various stats sources seem so varied don't they! According to the ESPN, Wood made only 9 tackles.

http://www.espnscrum.com/six-nations-20 ... 33783.html

JM2K6 · Post by **JM2K6** » Sun Feb 03, 2013 3:28 pm

Yeah, think the RFU includes tackle assists.

geordie_6 · Post by **geordie_6** » Sun Feb 03, 2013 3:29 pm

JM2K6 wrote:Yeah, think the RFU includes tackle assists.

ESPN also seem to adjust their stats within a couple of days of the games as well.

Double · Post by **Double** » Sun Feb 03, 2013 3:39 pm

Foden might not be back against Ireland, apparently he was dire against Exeter yesterday.

Wendigo7 · Post by **Wendigo7** » Sun Feb 03, 2013 10:14 pm

Wendigo7 wrote:IRB 6N Ratings changes:

1. New Zealand 90.08
2. South Africa 86.94
3. Australia 86.87
4. France 85.07
5. England 83.90
6. Ireland 81.31
7. Samoa 78.71
8. Argentina 78.71
9. Wales 77.19
10. Italy 76.24

In the 2 games, no changes were seen in the England vs Scotland game as the gap was too big, whilst Ireland gained a point against Wales and Wales lost 1.2.

Here are the possibles for the Italy/France game:

France can gain nothing if they win
Draw - Fra -1 Italy +1
Italy - 1-15 pt - 2 pt increase
Ita by 15 or more - 3 pts increase

Thought I'd update it for the brilliant Italian lads today

:

1. New Zealand 90.08
2. South Africa 86.94
3. Australia 86.87
4. England 83.90 (+1)
5. France 83.07 (-1)
6. Ireland 81.31
7. Samoa 78.71
8. Argentina 78.71
9. Italy 78.24 (+1)
10. Wales 77.19 (-1)
11. Tonga 76.10
12. Scotland 75.83

geordie_6 · Post by **geordie_6** » Mon Feb 04, 2013 10:02 am

Morgan to be assessed today. 31 players gathered at the training base yesterday, nobody different to those prior to the Scotland game.

Wendigo7 · Post by **Wendigo7** » Mon Feb 04, 2013 10:37 am

geordie_6 wrote:Morgan to be assessed today. 31 players gathered at the training base yesterday, nobody different to those prior to the Scotland game.

Hope he's ok. Played his best game by a mile against Scotland on Saturday. More of the same please Ben.

England side for Ireland:

1. Marler
2. Youngs
3. Cole
4. Launchbury
5. Parling
6. Wood
7. Robshaw (c)
8. Morgan/Haskell
9. Youngs
10. Farrell
11. Brown
12. Twelvetrees
13. M. Tuilagi
14. Ashton
15. Goode

JM2K6 · Post by **JM2K6** » Mon Feb 04, 2013 10:41 am

I could see Toga's Tuilagi dream coming true (for one match only).

geordie_6 · Post by **geordie_6** » Mon Feb 04, 2013 10:51 am

Wendigo7 wrote:
geordie_6 wrote:Morgan to be assessed today. 31 players gathered at the training base yesterday, nobody different to those prior to the Scotland game.
Hope he's ok. Played his best game by a mile against Scotland on Saturday. More of the same please Ben.

England side for Ireland:

1. Marler
2. Youngs
3. Cole
4. Launchbury
5. Parling
6. Wood
7. Robshaw (c)
8. Morgan/Haskell
9. Youngs
10. Farrell
11. Brown
12. Twelvetrees
13. M. Tuilagi
14. Ashton
15. Goode

He was good, but I'm not sure it was his best. He was excellent in last season tournament.

It will be interesting to see, if Morgan cannot play against Ireland, whether Haskell comes in at 8 or 6. It could have been a straight swap when Morgan came off injured, but it was Wood who went to 8.

geordie_6 · Post by **geordie_6** » Mon Feb 04, 2013 5:54 pm

Tuilagi declared fit to face Ireland.

theo · Post by **theo** » Mon Feb 04, 2013 6:38 pm

JM2K6 wrote:I could see Toga's Tuilagi dream coming true (for one match only).

Same here.

I don't think you can risk Goode.

openclashXX · Post by **openclashXX** » Mon Feb 04, 2013 6:41 pm

16. Hartley
17. Vunipola
18. Wilson
19. Lawes
20. Kvesic
21. Care
22. Flood
23. Tuilagi

Please.

geordie_6 · Post by **geordie_6** » Mon Feb 04, 2013 6:43 pm

openclashXX wrote:16. Hartley
17. Vunipola
18. Wilson
19. Lawes
20. Kvesic
21. Care
22. Flood
23. Tuilagi

Please.

Would much rather see Vunipola in the #20 shirt, and Tuilagi starting at 13 with someone with pace in the #23.

JM2K6 · Post by **JM2K6** » Mon Feb 04, 2013 6:45 pm

openclashXX wrote:16. Hartley
17. Vunipola
18. Wilson
19. Lawes
20. Kvesic
21. Care
22. Flood
23. Tuilagi

Please.

Can we stick to what we know are the options? Fraser's been called up, and as far as I know Kvesic is still with the Saxons.

Also, good article by BCM prior to last weekend: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/rugbyu ... ition.html

openclashXX · Post by **openclashXX** » Mon Feb 04, 2013 6:48 pm

JM2K6 wrote:
openclashXX wrote:16. Hartley
17. Vunipola
18. Wilson
19. Lawes
20. Kvesic
21. Care
22. Flood
23. Tuilagi

Please.
Can we stick to what we know are the options? Fraser's been called up, and as far as I know Kvesic is still with the Saxons.

Kvesic has been training with the senior squad since Johnson got injured. Fraser is below him in the pecking order.

JM2K6 · Post by **JM2K6** » Mon Feb 04, 2013 6:48 pm

Ah, sorry. That had completely passed me by.

Given that Kvesic does have more experience of 8 than most of the "flexible" options he's not a terrible shout for the bench.

openclashXX · Post by **openclashXX** » Mon Feb 04, 2013 6:50 pm

geordie_6 wrote:
openclashXX wrote:16. Hartley
17. Vunipola
18. Wilson
19. Lawes
20. Kvesic
21. Care
22. Flood
23. Tuilagi

Please.
Would much rather see Vunipola in the #20 shirt, and Tuilagi starting at 13 with someone with pace in the #23.

Tuilagi should be used as an impact sub, aside from the stellar performances of 12T and Barritt last weekend, imagine Tuilagi coming off the bench with 25 minutes to go, running at tired Irish bodies, a very appealling prospect.

geordie_6 · Post by **geordie_6** » Mon Feb 04, 2013 6:51 pm

openclashXX wrote:
geordie_6 wrote:
openclashXX wrote:16. Hartley
17. Vunipola
18. Wilson
19. Lawes
20. Kvesic
21. Care
22. Flood
23. Tuilagi

Please.
Would much rather see Vunipola in the #20 shirt, and Tuilagi starting at 13 with someone with pace in the #23.
Tuilagi should be used as an impact sub, aside from the stellar performances of 12T and Barritt last weekend, imagine Tuilagi coming off the bench with 25 minutes to go, running at tired Irish bodies, a very appealling prospect.

Barritt was solid, certainly not stellar.

openclashXX · Post by **openclashXX** » Mon Feb 04, 2013 6:53 pm

geordie_6 wrote:
openclashXX wrote:
geordie_6 wrote:
openclashXX wrote:16. Hartley
17. Vunipola
18. Wilson
19. Lawes
20. Kvesic
21. Care
22. Flood
23. Tuilagi

Please.
Would much rather see Vunipola in the #20 shirt, and Tuilagi starting at 13 with someone with pace in the #23.
Tuilagi should be used as an impact sub, aside from the stellar performances of 12T and Barritt last weekend, imagine Tuilagi coming off the bench with 25 minutes to go, running at tired Irish bodies, a very appealling prospect.

Barritt was solid, certainly not stellar.

He did everything that was asked of him and nothing that warrants his dropping, particularly given the great role he has played in England's midfield for the last few matches. Tuilagi is also not quite match fit, he hasn't played in almost a month by my count.

geordie_6 · Post by **geordie_6** » Mon Feb 04, 2013 6:59 pm

openclashXX wrote:
geordie_6 wrote:
openclashXX wrote:
geordie_6 wrote:
openclashXX wrote:16. Hartley
17. Vunipola
18. Wilson
19. Lawes
20. Kvesic
21. Care
22. Flood
23. Tuilagi

Please.
Would much rather see Vunipola in the #20 shirt, and Tuilagi starting at 13 with someone with pace in the #23.
Tuilagi should be used as an impact sub, aside from the stellar performances of 12T and Barritt last weekend, imagine Tuilagi coming off the bench with 25 minutes to go, running at tired Irish bodies, a very appealling prospect.

Barritt was solid, certainly not stellar.
He did everything that was asked of him and nothing that warrants his dropping, particularly given the great role he has played in England's midfield for the last few matches. Tuilagi is also not quite match fit, he hasn't played in almost a month by my count.

Tuilagi is a far greater attacking weapon, Barritt offers little in attack.

geordie_6 · Post by **geordie_6** » Mon Feb 04, 2013 8:08 pm

The Saracens flanker Will Fraser has been called up as injury cover for Morgan while Wasps No8 Billy Vunipola was undergoing a fitness test on his ankle injury at Twickenham this afternoon.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/sport/2013/fe ... nd-ireland

openclashXX · Post by **openclashXX** » Mon Feb 04, 2013 11:56 pm

geordie_6 wrote:
openclashXX wrote: He did everything that was asked of him and nothing that warrants his dropping, particularly given the great role he has played in England's midfield for the last few matches. Tuilagi is also not quite match fit, he hasn't played in almost a month by my count.
Tuilagi is a far greater attacking weapon, Barritt offers little in attack.

What sort of message would it send to the squad that you can play well consistently over several test matches and win against the world champions, and then have your place taken from you by a youngster who puts in one good performance against Scotland?

Barritt should not be dropped.

Wendigo7 · Post by **Wendigo7** » Tue Feb 05, 2013 12:23 am

openclashXX wrote:
geordie_6 wrote:
openclashXX wrote: He did everything that was asked of him and nothing that warrants his dropping, particularly given the great role he has played in England's midfield for the last few matches. Tuilagi is also not quite match fit, he hasn't played in almost a month by my count.
Tuilagi is a far greater attacking weapon, Barritt offers little in attack.
What sort of message would it send to the squad that you can play well consistently over several test matches and win against the world champions, and then have your place taken from you by a youngster who puts in one good performance against Scotland?

Barritt should not be dropped.

It's a hard 1 to call. The Rugby Paper thinks hell pick 36 and Tuilagi. Personally I can't see it. Tuilagis been struggling for a month with a niggle. Barritts played well. Keep the combo, drop strettle and bring Tuilagi onto the bench. Kvesic potentially as 8 cover for Haskell.

Come French game Tuilagi has more time training and fitness recuperation and is more in line with a return then. Same as Freddie B.

geordie_6 · Post by **geordie_6** » Tue Feb 05, 2013 9:59 am

openclashXX wrote:
geordie_6 wrote:
openclashXX wrote: He did everything that was asked of him and nothing that warrants his dropping, particularly given the great role he has played in England's midfield for the last few matches. Tuilagi is also not quite match fit, he hasn't played in almost a month by my count.
Tuilagi is a far greater attacking weapon, Barritt offers little in attack.
What sort of message would it send to the squad that you can play well consistently over several test matches and win against the world champions, and then have your place taken from you by a youngster who puts in one good performance against Scotland?

Barritt should not be dropped.

For the sake of moving the team forward and developing he should be. He has done well, but is a stop gap.

I can understand if they move him to the bench and retain the centres, but I would much rather see us go with a positive, attacking centre partnership.

DragsterDriver · Post by **DragsterDriver** » Tue Feb 05, 2013 10:05 am

A one cap player and one coming back from injury?

He'll play 12t and barritt with tuilagi coming off the bench.

Wendigo7 · Post by **Wendigo7** » Tue Feb 05, 2013 10:18 am

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Au-OI0ESvFY - Brilliant

Our England boys doing ... BMW proud :S

Luke Cowan-Dickie in the background, the U20 side?

JM2K6 · Post by **JM2K6** » Tue Feb 05, 2013 10:43 am

Wendigo7 wrote:https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Au-OI0ESvFY - Brilliant

Our England boys doing ... BMW proud :S

Luke Cowan-Dickie in the background, the U20 side?

Almost but not quite as awful as the Ireland's Call one.

SELondon · Post by **SELondon** » Tue Feb 05, 2013 5:48 pm

DragsterDriver wrote:A one cap player and one coming back from injury?

He'll play 12t and barritt with tuilagi coming off the bench.

Dunno, he's not averse to a gamble here and there.

I personally thought Barritt looked very limited at 13 - hasn't got the pace or footwork to threaten a break, can't fix a man and give it, all he did was tackle and carry the ball forwards reasonably well in traffic. If he's not at 12, I think his tackling is somewhat wasted. I'm ok with him at 12, I want a 13 at 13.

I also want Mike Brown at full-back and someone more suited to the left wing on the left wing. Preferably a left winger, but I appreciate that might be a step too far for Lancaster and his crazy position bending ways, bless him and his game winning ways.

DragsterDriver · Post by **DragsterDriver** » Tue Feb 05, 2013 5:53 pm

For a change i'll trust the coaches judgement

SELondon · Post by **SELondon** » Tue Feb 05, 2013 6:34 pm

DragsterDriver wrote:For a change i'll trust the coaches judgement

Crazy talk

maverickmak · Post by **maverickmak** » Tue Feb 05, 2013 6:38 pm

Just been watching Haskell-cam again from the World Cup. Its probably partly the reason we did so poorly, but damn it was hilarious.

openclashXX · Post by **openclashXX** » Tue Feb 05, 2013 8:06 pm

Official RFU ‏@Official_RFU

Stuart Lancaster has retained 25 players, including Billy Vunipola and Thomas Waldrom, to continue preparations for #IREvENG #rugby

fatcat · Post by **fatcat** » Tue Feb 05, 2013 8:08 pm

So Saturday's squad - Morgan + TW & BV & MT

geordie_6 · Post by **geordie_6** » Tue Feb 05, 2013 8:09 pm

Botha, Burns, Dickson, Foden, Fraser, Joseph and Kvesic back to clubs. Morgan to continue to receive treatment.

geordie_6 · Post by **geordie_6** » Tue Feb 05, 2013 8:10 pm

It does raise the question once again, why Strettle?

JM2K6 · Post by **JM2K6** » Tue Feb 05, 2013 8:10 pm

Could be a close call for BillyV then.

openclashXX · Post by **openclashXX** » Tue Feb 05, 2013 8:11 pm

geordie_6 wrote:It does raise the question once again, why Strettle?

Catt has hinted that Tuilagi will be on the bench so it seems logical to assume that Strettle will not be in the match day 23.

geordie_6 · Post by **geordie_6** » Tue Feb 05, 2013 8:12 pm

For me, it is an indication that Vunipola is at least going to sit on the bench, provided he comes through training this week following his ankle knock. Waldrom retained in case he does not do so.