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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:19 pm 
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Wilson's Toffee wrote:
Turbogoat wrote:
Imagine if the FBI had actually been able to speak to the principle actors involved and actually managed to come up with something exculpatory - then you might have a point.



Imagine this is the FBI's seventh bite at the cherry..... She should have reported it to the police and get it done. Like other women have to. Instead of grandstanding in front of the world, in Senate ....

Privileged woman, special treatment, not the raw and rough handling a common whore or poor woman have to expect as normal:

Put the pipe down you nasty old twat. Puerile gibberish.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:19 pm 
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FBI do very very few sex crimes. Those are local police jurisdiction.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:21 pm 
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saffer13 wrote:
Turbogoat wrote:
Fangle wrote:
Turbogoat wrote:
Imagine if the FBI had actually been able to speak to the principle actors involved and actually managed to come up with something exculpatory - then you might have a point.

If she actually has credible witnesses, then she should go to court. The great majority of the media will support her.


She did actually name several people who were then backed up by an entry in Kav's calendar that would've been worth having trained FBI investigators actually get to talk to, but that never came to pass.

Oh well.

So it should be easy for people who actually investigate these crimes (not the FBI in this case) to make a case and bring charges. :thumbup:


I never said that they'd get enough for a criminal trial. There was always a higher probability that they'd uncover something exculpatory - which obviously would've been much better for the Kav and there would've been actual closure to this, rather than the half assed political window dressing.

But, it's too late now, it's done.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:22 pm 
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Turbogoat wrote:
saffer13 wrote:
Turbogoat wrote:
Fangle wrote:
Turbogoat wrote:
Imagine if the FBI had actually been able to speak to the principle actors involved and actually managed to come up with something exculpatory - then you might have a point.

If she actually has credible witnesses, then she should go to court. The great majority of the media will support her.


She did actually name several people who were then backed up by an entry in Kav's calendar that would've been worth having trained FBI investigators actually get to talk to, but that never came to pass.

Oh well.

So it should be easy for people who actually investigate these crimes (not the FBI in this case) to make a case and bring charges. :thumbup:


I never said that they'd get enough for a criminal trial. There was always a higher probability that they'd uncover something exculpatory - which obviously would've been much better for the Kav and there would've been actual closure to this, rather than the half assed political window dressing.

But, it's too late now, it's done.

So you wanted a witch hunt then...with no time constraints, etc. Got it.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:24 pm 
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Haley resigning? Curious.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:27 pm 
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saffer13 wrote:
So you wanted a witch hunt then...with no time constraints, etc. Got it.

When it comes to something as important as someone joining the Supreme Court, why not?


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:29 pm 
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saffer13 wrote:
[
So you wanted a witch hunt then...with no time constraints, etc. Got it.



sigh... no. Don't lower yourself to that level, you're better than that.
An honest investigation by the FBI as originally intended was non-partisan, could've been very good for Kav, is not a witch hunt.
But that's been and gone. All that remains is for 'men' to line up and abuse the person who reported (eventually, yeah yeah) a sexual assault. That inevitable reaction is a massive reason why so many women are so hesitant about reporting sexual assault. It's messed up that she is now seen as a free-for-all target by some very, very small 'men' in the wake of all this.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:29 pm 
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Seneca of the Night wrote:
Haley resigning? Curious.


UN Ambassdor? Really? Info?

edit: found:

https://edition.cnn.com/2018/10/09/poli ... l?adkey=bn

Interesting.


Last edited by Turbogoat on Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:30 pm 
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Seneca of the Night wrote:
Haley resigning? Curious.


Indeed. Can't find anything giving her reasons.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:33 pm 
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She's having a joint press conference with Trump apparently - doesn't sound like a firing/falling out situation (Trump would be hiding in his tweeting cubicle for that).


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:35 pm 
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penguin wrote:
Seneca of the Night wrote:
Haley resigning? Curious.


Indeed. Can't find anything giving her reasons.


developed a conscience - in fairness to Trump's supporters he's continuing to do what he said he'd do...draining the swamp


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:35 pm 
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Dons new sex toy gone.

Gonna be a great new book.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:36 pm 
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unseenwork wrote:
saffer13 wrote:
So you wanted a witch hunt then...with no time constraints, etc. Got it.

When it comes to something as important as someone joining the Supreme Court, why not?


All important job interviews should be accompanied by a witch hunt. It should be like checking references really.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:38 pm 
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penguin wrote:
Seneca of the Night wrote:
Haley resigning? Curious.


Indeed. Can't find anything giving her reasons.


A looming expenses scandal apparently

Draining the swamp (that he created)

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/americas/us-politics/nikki-haley-resigns-resignation-un-ambassador-trump-luxury-private-jet-white-house-a8575876.html


Last edited by BokJock on Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:40 pm 
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zt1903 wrote:
Rinkals wrote:
Found it.

https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-40937429

Quote:
The 2013 incident only became public in 2015 when radio personality David Mueller- who lost his job after Ms Swift's team reported the groping claim to his radio station - filed a defamation lawsuit against Ms Swift.

With the incident out in the open, Ms Swift filed a countersuit alleging sexual assault - which she has just won.

In court, Taylor Swift's mother, Andrea Swift, said she did not go to police when her daughter first told her she had been groped because: "I did not want this event to define her life."

"I did not want her to have to live through the endless memes and gifs that tabloid media and internet trolls decided to come up with - doctoring the pictures… and making her relive this awful moment over and over again," she said.
...
Taylor Swift's reasons for not going to the police, as told by her mother, who is part of her management team, are revealing. The case highlights how some victims fear being ridiculed, not being believed or not being taken seriously after reporting an alleged sexual assault.


Quote:
The trial showed how some defence lawyers try to undermine the credibility of an alleged victim.

But some of the most potent moments occurred when Taylor Swift refused to let that happen.

At one point, rejecting an accusation that she had misidentified Mueller, she said: "I'm not going to allow you or your client to say I am to blame."


I am quoting parts of the report on Taylor Swift's court case, to hilight the similarities between her case and Dr. Ford's and to suggest that these experiences are not isolated incidents for a lot of women. Trump's attempts to humiliate Ford have certainly worked extremely well, but I suspect that there will be repercussions.

I found Ford's testimony to be a lot more compelling than Kavaugh's, and although one likes to presume innocence in the absence of indisputable evidence (which doesn't include hand-drawn calendars) I found it far more likely that he was lying than that she was.


You are, of course, entitled to your opinion but FWIW I think it is far more likely that she was lying than he was.


Yes, that is Trump's current view.

At the time, I think he called her "a very credible witness" and "very compelling". Can i ask why you are so convinced that she was lying? and that Kavanaughs own description of himself as a moderate drinker was easier to believe?


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:43 pm 
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Rinkals wrote:
zt1903 wrote:
Rinkals wrote:
Found it.

https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-40937429

Quote:
The 2013 incident only became public in 2015 when radio personality David Mueller- who lost his job after Ms Swift's team reported the groping claim to his radio station - filed a defamation lawsuit against Ms Swift.

With the incident out in the open, Ms Swift filed a countersuit alleging sexual assault - which she has just won.

In court, Taylor Swift's mother, Andrea Swift, said she did not go to police when her daughter first told her she had been groped because: "I did not want this event to define her life."

"I did not want her to have to live through the endless memes and gifs that tabloid media and internet trolls decided to come up with - doctoring the pictures… and making her relive this awful moment over and over again," she said.
...
Taylor Swift's reasons for not going to the police, as told by her mother, who is part of her management team, are revealing. The case highlights how some victims fear being ridiculed, not being believed or not being taken seriously after reporting an alleged sexual assault.


Quote:
The trial showed how some defence lawyers try to undermine the credibility of an alleged victim.

But some of the most potent moments occurred when Taylor Swift refused to let that happen.

At one point, rejecting an accusation that she had misidentified Mueller, she said: "I'm not going to allow you or your client to say I am to blame."


I am quoting parts of the report on Taylor Swift's court case, to hilight the similarities between her case and Dr. Ford's and to suggest that these experiences are not isolated incidents for a lot of women. Trump's attempts to humiliate Ford have certainly worked extremely well, but I suspect that there will be repercussions.

I found Ford's testimony to be a lot more compelling than Kavaugh's, and although one likes to presume innocence in the absence of indisputable evidence (which doesn't include hand-drawn calendars) I found it far more likely that he was lying than that she was.


You are, of course, entitled to your opinion but FWIW I think it is far more likely that she was lying than he was.


Yes, that is Trump's current view.

At the time, I think he called her "a very credible witness" and "very compelling". Can i ask why you are so convinced that she was lying? and that Kavanaughs own description of himself as a moderate drinker was easier to believe?


Most Yanks who claimt to have a drinking problem wouldn't even qualify as a regular in an English pub. Lightweights, the lot of 'em.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:48 pm 
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She would be a great VP.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:52 pm 
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Hayley resigns the morning before Kanye visits the WH...............


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:55 pm 
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happyhooker wrote:
Hayley resigns the morning before Kanye visits the WH...............


Now Nikki, Im really happy for you, and imma let you finish, but Ye is going to be the greatest UN ambassador of all time.

He'll make speeches longer than Castro.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 3:59 pm 
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happyhooker wrote:
Hayley resigns the morning before Kanye visits the WH...............


Good call.

It really wouldn't surprise me.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 4:02 pm 
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Rinkals wrote:
happyhooker wrote:
Hayley resigns the morning before Kanye visits the WH...............


Good call.

It really wouldn't surprise me.


That would be amazing


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 4:13 pm 
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Quote:
A senior diplomatic source connected to the UN tells CNN that Haley told her staff this morning that she said has done her two years and it is time to move on.


Must have something lined up...seems pretty weak as a reason to go. The expenses thing sounds too small (by this administration's standards).


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 4:18 pm 
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zzzz wrote:
She would be a great VP.


Got a good one atm.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 4:25 pm 
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Another one jumps off the sinking ship....


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 4:28 pm 
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Seneca of the Night wrote:
zzzz wrote:
She would be a great VP.


Got a good one atm.


I for one admired Governor Haley's handling of the confederate flag issue in SC post Dylan Roof. I thought she did the right thing even though it pissed some of her constituents off.

As for Pence? I know SOTN is having a larf here...


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 4:28 pm 
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They need a calm, steady hand at the tiller now - with tricky international relationships all over the globe they need someone who can apply balm to those sore points of conflict and use diplomacy to act as a counterpoint to Trump's brash style. Clearly there's only one man for the job...John Bolton.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 4:50 pm 
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penguin wrote:
They need a calm, steady hand at the tiller now - with tricky international relationships all over the globe they need someone who can apply balm to those sore points of conflict and use diplomacy to act as a counterpoint to Trump's brash style. Clearly there's only one man for the job...John Bolton.


Ye


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 5:07 pm 
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penguin wrote:
They need a calm, steady hand at the tiller now - with tricky international relationships all over the globe they need someone who can apply balm to those sore points of conflict and use diplomacy to act as a counterpoint to Trump's brash style. Clearly there's only one man for the job...John Bolton.


:lol:

At least he knows where the canteen is.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 5:20 pm 
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Here's another one. Krugman in the NY Times:

Quote:
And now senior figures in the Republican Party, which controls all three branches of the federal government — if you had any questions about whether the Supreme Court was a partisan institution, they should be gone now — are sounding just like the white nationalists in Hungary and Poland. What does this mean?

The answer, I submit, is that the G.O.P. is an authoritarian regime in waiting.

Trump himself clearly has the same instincts as the foreign dictators he so openly admires. He demands that public officials be loyal to him personally, not to the American people. He threatens political opponents with retribution — two years after the last election, he’s still leading chants of “Lock her up.” He attacks the news media as enemies of the people.

Add in the investigations closing in on Trump’s many scandals, from tax cheating to self-dealing in office to possible collusion with Russia, all of which give him every incentive to shut down freedom of the press and independence of law enforcement. Does anyone doubt that Trump would like to go full authoritarian, given the chance?

And who’s going to stop him? The senators parroting conspiracy theories about Soros-paid protesters? The newly rigged Supreme Court? What we’ve learned in the past few weeks is that there is no gap between Trump and his party, nobody who will say stop in the name of American values.

But as I said, the G.O.P. is an authoritarian regime in waiting, not yet one in practice. What’s it waiting for?

Well, think of what Trump and his party might do if they retain both houses of Congress in the coming election. If you aren’t terrified of where we might be in the very near future, you aren’t paying attention.


https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/08/opin ... e=Homepage


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 5:23 pm 
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Seneca of the Night wrote:
Here's another one. Krugman in the NY Times:

Quote:
And now senior figures in the Republican Party, which controls all three branches of the federal government — if you had any questions about whether the Supreme Court was a partisan institution, they should be gone now — are sounding just like the white nationalists in Hungary and Poland. What does this mean?

The answer, I submit, is that the G.O.P. is an authoritarian regime in waiting.

Trump himself clearly has the same instincts as the foreign dictators he so openly admires. He demands that public officials be loyal to him personally, not to the American people. He threatens political opponents with retribution — two years after the last election, he’s still leading chants of “Lock her up.” He attacks the news media as enemies of the people.

Add in the investigations closing in on Trump’s many scandals, from tax cheating to self-dealing in office to possible collusion with Russia, all of which give him every incentive to shut down freedom of the press and independence of law enforcement. Does anyone doubt that Trump would like to go full authoritarian, given the chance?

And who’s going to stop him? The senators parroting conspiracy theories about Soros-paid protesters? The newly rigged Supreme Court? What we’ve learned in the past few weeks is that there is no gap between Trump and his party, nobody who will say stop in the name of American values.

But as I said, the G.O.P. is an authoritarian regime in waiting, not yet one in practice. What’s it waiting for?

Well, think of what Trump and his party might do if they retain both houses of Congress in the coming election. If you aren’t terrified of where we might be in the very near future, you aren’t paying attention.


https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/08/opin ... e=Homepage

Which part do you have a problem with?


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 5:24 pm 
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On reflection, reading Krugman there, it may well be that the GOP presents such a threat to the Republic that it should be banned. Maybe a select group of coastal pundits and entertainers could get together to determine if the GOP should be banned, lest they turn America into an Authoritarian state.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 5:25 pm 
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The waiting?


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 5:25 pm 
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Rinkals wrote:
Seneca of the Night wrote:
Here's another one. Krugman in the NY Times:

Quote:
And now senior figures in the Republican Party, which controls all three branches of the federal government — if you had any questions about whether the Supreme Court was a partisan institution, they should be gone now — are sounding just like the white nationalists in Hungary and Poland. What does this mean?

The answer, I submit, is that the G.O.P. is an authoritarian regime in waiting.

Trump himself clearly has the same instincts as the foreign dictators he so openly admires. He demands that public officials be loyal to him personally, not to the American people. He threatens political opponents with retribution — two years after the last election, he’s still leading chants of “Lock her up.” He attacks the news media as enemies of the people.

Add in the investigations closing in on Trump’s many scandals, from tax cheating to self-dealing in office to possible collusion with Russia, all of which give him every incentive to shut down freedom of the press and independence of law enforcement. Does anyone doubt that Trump would like to go full authoritarian, given the chance?

And who’s going to stop him? The senators parroting conspiracy theories about Soros-paid protesters? The newly rigged Supreme Court? What we’ve learned in the past few weeks is that there is no gap between Trump and his party, nobody who will say stop in the name of American values.

But as I said, the G.O.P. is an authoritarian regime in waiting, not yet one in practice. What’s it waiting for?

Well, think of what Trump and his party might do if they retain both houses of Congress in the coming election. If you aren’t terrified of where we might be in the very near future, you aren’t paying attention.


https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/08/opin ... e=Homepage

Which part do you have a problem with?


The eight words just above what I am typing now.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 5:28 pm 
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penguin wrote:
The waiting?


I doubt anyone is waiting as urgently as Krugman.

Image

"I TOLD YOU THEY WERE NAZIS"


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 9:16 pm 
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Seneca of the Night wrote:
Rinkals wrote:
Seneca of the Night wrote:
Here's another one. Krugman in the NY Times:

Quote:
And now senior figures in the Republican Party, which controls all three branches of the federal government — if you had any questions about whether the Supreme Court was a partisan institution, they should be gone now — are sounding just like the white nationalists in Hungary and Poland. What does this mean?

The answer, I submit, is that the G.O.P. is an authoritarian regime in waiting.

Trump himself clearly has the same instincts as the foreign dictators he so openly admires. He demands that public officials be loyal to him personally, not to the American people. He threatens political opponents with retribution — two years after the last election, he’s still leading chants of “Lock her up.” He attacks the news media as enemies of the people.

Add in the investigations closing in on Trump’s many scandals, from tax cheating to self-dealing in office to possible collusion with Russia, all of which give him every incentive to shut down freedom of the press and independence of law enforcement. Does anyone doubt that Trump would like to go full authoritarian, given the chance?

And who’s going to stop him? The senators parroting conspiracy theories about Soros-paid protesters? The newly rigged Supreme Court? What we’ve learned in the past few weeks is that there is no gap between Trump and his party, nobody who will say stop in the name of American values.

But as I said, the G.O.P. is an authoritarian regime in waiting, not yet one in practice. What’s it waiting for?

Well, think of what Trump and his party might do if they retain both houses of Congress in the coming election. If you aren’t terrified of where we might be in the very near future, you aren’t paying attention.


https://www.nytimes.com/2018/10/08/opin ... e=Homepage

Which part do you have a problem with?


The eight words just above what I am typing now.

Well, that's clear.

So any opinion which doesn't exactly coincide with yours?


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 9:39 pm 
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Rinkals wrote:
happyhooker wrote:
Hayley resigns the morning before Kanye visits the WH...............


Good call.

It really wouldn't surprise me.

Apparently Trump wants to appoint Ivanka.

Colour me surprised.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 9:59 pm 
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Seneca of the Night wrote:
zzzz wrote:
She would be a great VP.


Got a good one atm.


:lol:

You see, there’s yer problem right there.

All that good work on the danger of ideologues, undone by a careless troll tell.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 10:01 pm 
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Turbogoat wrote:
Imagine if the FBI had actually been able to speak to the principle actors involved and actually managed to come up with something exculpatory - then you might have a point.

What stopped the FBI speaking to them?


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 10:09 pm 
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Rinkals wrote:
Rinkals wrote:
happyhooker wrote:
Hayley resigns the morning before Kanye visits the WH...............


Good call.

It really wouldn't surprise me.

Apparently Trump wants to appoint Ivanka.

Colour me surprised.


He’s probably trolling.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 09, 2018 10:44 pm 
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zt1903 wrote:
Rinkals wrote:
Rinkals wrote:
happyhooker wrote:
Hayley resigns the morning before Kanye visits the WH...............


Good call.

It really wouldn't surprise me.

Apparently Trump wants to appoint Ivanka.

Colour me surprised.


He’s probably trolling.

You don't think that betrays your gullibility?

I think it's more likely that he wanted to appoint her but was dissuaded by WH staff..


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