750 MW

All things Rugby
frillage
Posts: 6663
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: 750 MW

Post by frillage »

HKCJ wrote:If I find out you’re building a secret underground power station in the New Town slick there’ll be hell to pay
I heard he was trying to sell Dounreay to Africa.
User avatar
Uncle Fester
Posts: 19965
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: 750 mW

Post by Uncle Fester »

A5D5E5 wrote:
Uncle Fester wrote:
A5D5E5 wrote:
Spyglass wrote:
slick wrote:
I did, thanks.

So pretty chunky then?

I have some follow up questions if you, or anyone else, knows about these things....

What kind of size would that power station be? Say in terms of rugby pitches?

Any ideas of costs of decommissioning, moving (overseas) and putting back together again - appreciate this would be very, very rough.
Typical power densities of various types of power plants are:

Gas CCGT: 80MW/acre
Nuclear: 30MW/acre
Coal: 10MW/acre
Wind/Solar: <1MW/acre

Obviously some generalizations in these numbers and modern H technology CCGT plants would be higher than the 80MW/acre

As for plant relocations, this makes some sense for stranded low operating hours gas turbine assets (we used to do quite a lot of these but this market has dried up due to the reduced price of new gas turbines), but the economics don't really work for coal, as it's difficult to relocate the boilers, fuel handling etc. There are too many variables to give a meaningful cost estimate.
Am I the only person who loves the mixing of SI and imperial units in this way?
30 metres of 4 inch pipe okay for you luv?
Thanks. Put it over there with the 8' x 4' 18mm ply and 3.6m 2x4s.
I love metric but when it comes to pipe sizing, inch OD is your only man.
There's a poor dairy somewhere in Ireland that has to go to Germany for all their spare parts because a certain engineer in his youthful enthusiasm decided the whole place should be specced with DIN pipe.
Nolanator
Posts: 39506
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Dublin

Re: 750 MW

Post by Nolanator »

Is it specialist equipment or infrastructure? Swagelok supply both, so it's not an issue sourcing metric fittings.

We use a shit load of 1/4" SS piping, but we purchased a huge portion of our equipment from a Finnish company, who deal.in metric. Can cause issues the odd time, bit it's mostly ok.

In my PhD group, some equipment had been brought over from Germany (metric), while some had been purchased through Irish/UK vendors (imperial). All house gas lines were in imperial. Bit daft at times, especially considering how close 1/4" and 6mm are.
User avatar
happyhooker
Posts: 23131
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: 750 MW

Post by happyhooker »

Nolanator wrote:Is it specialist equipment or infrastructure? Swagelok supply both, so it's not an issue sourcing metric fittings.

We use a shit load of 1/4" SS piping, but we purchased a huge portion of our equipment from a Finnish company, who deal.in metric. Can cause issues the odd time, bit it's mostly ok.

In my PhD group, some equipment had been brought over from Germany (metric), while some had been purchased through Irish/UK vendors (imperial). All house gas lines were in imperial. Bit daft at times, especially considering how close 1/4" and 6mm are.
for domestic plumbing in the uk, including gas, we now use metric measurements, but you can hook up imperial kit with no problem 99% of the time
User avatar
Saint
Posts: 15686
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: South Oxfordshire

Re: 750 MW

Post by Saint »

happyhooker wrote:
Nolanator wrote:Is it specialist equipment or infrastructure? Swagelok supply both, so it's not an issue sourcing metric fittings.

We use a shit load of 1/4" SS piping, but we purchased a huge portion of our equipment from a Finnish company, who deal.in metric. Can cause issues the odd time, bit it's mostly ok.

In my PhD group, some equipment had been brought over from Germany (metric), while some had been purchased through Irish/UK vendors (imperial). All house gas lines were in imperial. Bit daft at times, especially considering how close 1/4" and 6mm are.
for domestic plumbing in the uk, including gas, we now use metric measurements, but you can hook up imperial kit with no problem 99% of the time

Yeah - when we retrofitted underfloor heating last summer, the new pipework was metric, but had to hook into the original imperial. One 69 pence convertor and some quick welding later, all sorted
User avatar
happyhooker
Posts: 23131
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: 750 MW

Post by happyhooker »

Saint wrote:
happyhooker wrote:
Nolanator wrote:Is it specialist equipment or infrastructure? Swagelok supply both, so it's not an issue sourcing metric fittings.

We use a shit load of 1/4" SS piping, but we purchased a huge portion of our equipment from a Finnish company, who deal.in metric. Can cause issues the odd time, bit it's mostly ok.

In my PhD group, some equipment had been brought over from Germany (metric), while some had been purchased through Irish/UK vendors (imperial). All house gas lines were in imperial. Bit daft at times, especially considering how close 1/4" and 6mm are.
for domestic plumbing in the uk, including gas, we now use metric measurements, but you can hook up imperial kit with no problem 99% of the time

Yeah - when we retrofitted underfloor heating last summer, the new pipework was metric, but had to hook into the original imperial. One 69 pence convertor and some quick welding later, all sorted
even works on most compression and pushfit (for water, obvs)
Nolanator
Posts: 39506
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Dublin

Re: 750 MW

Post by Nolanator »

happyhooker wrote:
Nolanator wrote:Is it specialist equipment or infrastructure? Swagelok supply both, so it's not an issue sourcing metric fittings.

We use a shit load of 1/4" SS piping, but we purchased a huge portion of our equipment from a Finnish company, who deal.in metric. Can cause issues the odd time, bit it's mostly ok.

In my PhD group, some equipment had been brought over from Germany (metric), while some had been purchased through Irish/UK vendors (imperial). All house gas lines were in imperial. Bit daft at times, especially considering how close 1/4" and 6mm are.
for domestic plumbing in the uk, including gas, we now use metric measurements, but you can hook up imperial kit with no problem 99% of the time
Makes sense, it'll all be metric eventually. What about industrial/commercial?

It's handy because you can fit a 6mm pipe into 1/4" furrules and connect to a 1/4" fitting. So newer pipes can fit into older equipment. Can't go the other way, though.
Then some arse mixes up the bits and you end up digging through the nuts looking for the ring that denotes metric dimensions, or poking a pipe offcut through ferrules/nuts to see what works.
User avatar
happyhooker
Posts: 23131
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: 750 MW

Post by happyhooker »

Nolanator wrote:
happyhooker wrote:
Nolanator wrote:Is it specialist equipment or infrastructure? Swagelok supply both, so it's not an issue sourcing metric fittings.

We use a shit load of 1/4" SS piping, but we purchased a huge portion of our equipment from a Finnish company, who deal.in metric. Can cause issues the odd time, bit it's mostly ok.

In my PhD group, some equipment had been brought over from Germany (metric), while some had been purchased through Irish/UK vendors (imperial). All house gas lines were in imperial. Bit daft at times, especially considering how close 1/4" and 6mm are.
for domestic plumbing in the uk, including gas, we now use metric measurements, but you can hook up imperial kit with no problem 99% of the time
Makes sense, it'll all be metric eventually. What about industrial/commercial?

It's handy because you can fit a 6mm pipe into 1/4" furrules and connect to a 1/4" fitting. So newer pipes can fit into older equipment. Can't go the other way, though.
Then some arse mixes up the bits and you end up digging through the nuts looking for the ring that denotes metric dimensions, or poking a pipe offcut through ferrules/nuts to see what works.
yea, thise as well. i've built a few breweries in places that were originally fitted out in imperial. no problem apart from the initial annoyance that you'd been lied to by the property agent
User avatar
Lord Denning
Posts: 879
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: 750 MW

Post by Lord Denning »

The foot-poundal is a unit that no one will ever miss.

Along with groats, guineas, morgens and cow’s grass.
User avatar
Uncle Fester
Posts: 19965
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: 750 MW

Post by Uncle Fester »

Nolanator wrote:Is it specialist equipment or infrastructure? Swagelok supply both, so it's not an issue sourcing metric fittings.

We use a shit load of 1/4" SS piping, but we purchased a huge portion of our equipment from a Finnish company, who deal.in metric. Can cause issues the odd time, bit it's mostly ok.

In my PhD group, some equipment had been brought over from Germany (metric), while some had been purchased through Irish/UK vendors (imperial). All house gas lines were in imperial. Bit daft at times, especially considering how close 1/4" and 6mm are.
Not specialist at all, just general piping. DN80 and 3" pipe cannot be welded directly together in a hygienic way. You'll end up with an ugly lip where dirt and contamination can collect at best and quite probably a shit weld that will fail easily. You'll get away with jimmys if it's not a hygienic application though.
User avatar
happyhooker
Posts: 23131
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: 750 MW

Post by happyhooker »

Uncle Fester wrote:
Nolanator wrote:Is it specialist equipment or infrastructure? Swagelok supply both, so it's not an issue sourcing metric fittings.

We use a shit load of 1/4" SS piping, but we purchased a huge portion of our equipment from a Finnish company, who deal.in metric. Can cause issues the odd time, bit it's mostly ok.

In my PhD group, some equipment had been brought over from Germany (metric), while some had been purchased through Irish/UK vendors (imperial). All house gas lines were in imperial. Bit daft at times, especially considering how close 1/4" and 6mm are.
Not specialist at all, just general piping. DN80 and 3" pipe cannot be welded directly together in a hygienic way. You'll end up with an ugly lip where dirt and contamination can collect at best and quite probably a shit weld that will fail easily. You'll get away with jimmys if it's not a hygienic application though.
i think nols works in a lab environment where 3" pipe is something the geeks dream about having
Nolanator
Posts: 39506
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Dublin

Re: 750 MW

Post by Nolanator »

Yep. Cooling is in 3/4", process gases in 1/4".

No need for anything bigger.
Spyglass
Posts: 397
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Houston

Re: 750 MW

Post by Spyglass »

Uncle Fester wrote:
Nolanator wrote:Is it specialist equipment or infrastructure? Swagelok supply both, so it's not an issue sourcing metric fittings.

We use a shit load of 1/4" SS piping, but we purchased a huge portion of our equipment from a Finnish company, who deal.in metric. Can cause issues the odd time, bit it's mostly ok.

In my PhD group, some equipment had been brought over from Germany (metric), while some had been purchased through Irish/UK vendors (imperial). All house gas lines were in imperial. Bit daft at times, especially considering how close 1/4" and 6mm are.
Not specialist at all, just general piping. DN80 and 3" pipe cannot be welded directly together in a hygienic way. You'll end up with an ugly lip where dirt and contamination can collect at best and quite probably a shit weld that will fail easily. You'll get away with jimmys if it's not a hygienic application though.
Provided they are the same Schedule, DN80 and 3"NB pipes have the same dimensions, so provided you use the correct welding procedure and it's executed by a qualified welder, it will be a perfectly good joint.
User avatar
Uncle Fester
Posts: 19965
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: 750 MW

Post by Uncle Fester »

Spyglass wrote:
Uncle Fester wrote:
Nolanator wrote:Is it specialist equipment or infrastructure? Swagelok supply both, so it's not an issue sourcing metric fittings.

We use a shit load of 1/4" SS piping, but we purchased a huge portion of our equipment from a Finnish company, who deal.in metric. Can cause issues the odd time, bit it's mostly ok.

In my PhD group, some equipment had been brought over from Germany (metric), while some had been purchased through Irish/UK vendors (imperial). All house gas lines were in imperial. Bit daft at times, especially considering how close 1/4" and 6mm are.
Not specialist at all, just general piping. DN80 and 3" pipe cannot be welded directly together in a hygienic way. You'll end up with an ugly lip where dirt and contamination can collect at best and quite probably a shit weld that will fail easily. You'll get away with jimmys if it's not a hygienic application though.
Provided they are the same Schedule, DN80 and 3"NB pipes have the same dimensions, so provided you use the correct welding procedure and it's executed by a qualified welder, it will be a perfectly good joint.
Inch OD dairy 1.5mm wall thickness tubing is problematic to match up with metric.
Spyglass
Posts: 397
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Houston

Re: 750 MW

Post by Spyglass »

Uncle Fester wrote:
Spyglass wrote:
Uncle Fester wrote:
Nolanator wrote:Is it specialist equipment or infrastructure? Swagelok supply both, so it's not an issue sourcing metric fittings.

We use a shit load of 1/4" SS piping, but we purchased a huge portion of our equipment from a Finnish company, who deal.in metric. Can cause issues the odd time, bit it's mostly ok.

In my PhD group, some equipment had been brought over from Germany (metric), while some had been purchased through Irish/UK vendors (imperial). All house gas lines were in imperial. Bit daft at times, especially considering how close 1/4" and 6mm are.
Not specialist at all, just general piping. DN80 and 3" pipe cannot be welded directly together in a hygienic way. You'll end up with an ugly lip where dirt and contamination can collect at best and quite probably a shit weld that will fail easily. You'll get away with jimmys if it's not a hygienic application though.
Provided they are the same Schedule, DN80 and 3"NB pipes have the same dimensions, so provided you use the correct welding procedure and it's executed by a qualified welder, it will be a perfectly good joint.
Inch OD dairy 1.5mm wall thickness tubing is problematic to match up with metric.
Ahh I see where the confusion arises, you initially mentioned 3" pipe (pipe sizing standards refer to bore), whereas you meant 3" tube (tube sizing standards refer to the OD). You would need a transition piece to join a 3" pipe to a 3" tube, even if they were the same schedule (wall thickness).

Either way, 1.5mm wall thickness is a very thin for a 3" tube....very low design pressure
Nolanator
Posts: 39506
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Dublin

Re: 750 MW

Post by Nolanator »

Never knew that distinction between piping and tubing. :thumbup:
Everything we use is tubing but hadn't realised what that specifically meant, although I'd presumed there was a reason.
User avatar
BlackMac
Posts: 7208
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Middle of the Lothians

Re: 750 MW

Post by BlackMac »

Looking at the size of my bloody energy bill, it would appear to be the amount used to power and heat my house for 3 months. :x
User avatar
Uncle Fester
Posts: 19965
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: 750 MW

Post by Uncle Fester »

Spyglass wrote:
Uncle Fester wrote:
Spyglass wrote:
Uncle Fester wrote:
Nolanator wrote:Is it specialist equipment or infrastructure? Swagelok supply both, so it's not an issue sourcing metric fittings.

We use a shit load of 1/4" SS piping, but we purchased a huge portion of our equipment from a Finnish company, who deal.in metric. Can cause issues the odd time, bit it's mostly ok.

In my PhD group, some equipment had been brought over from Germany (metric), while some had been purchased through Irish/UK vendors (imperial). All house gas lines were in imperial. Bit daft at times, especially considering how close 1/4" and 6mm are.
Not specialist at all, just general piping. DN80 and 3" pipe cannot be welded directly together in a hygienic way. You'll end up with an ugly lip where dirt and contamination can collect at best and quite probably a shit weld that will fail easily. You'll get away with jimmys if it's not a hygienic application though.
Provided they are the same Schedule, DN80 and 3"NB pipes have the same dimensions, so provided you use the correct welding procedure and it's executed by a qualified welder, it will be a perfectly good joint.
Inch OD dairy 1.5mm wall thickness tubing is problematic to match up with metric.
Ahh I see where the confusion arises, you initially mentioned 3" pipe (pipe sizing standards refer to bore), whereas you meant 3" tube (tube sizing standards refer to the OD). You would need a transition piece to join a 3" pipe to a 3" tube, even if they were the same schedule (wall thickness).

Either way, 1.5mm wall thickness is a very thin for a 3" tube....very low design pressure
You can tell I'm process rather than mech eng, can't you! ;-)
User avatar
slick
Posts: 8257
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am

Re: 750 MW

Post by slick »

Got a coal fired one to sell as well now if anyone is interested?
Spyglass
Posts: 397
Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2012 11:05 am
Location: Houston

Re: 750 MW

Post by Spyglass »

Uncle Fester wrote: You can tell I'm process rather than mech eng, can't you! ;-)
I just can't understand how us engineers get the reputation for being anally retentive..... :lol:
Post Reply