The Official Irish Rugby Thread

[Conspicuous]

I think Keenan did okay for his first real big test match. Certainly has potential. Ireland have a chronic problem with lack of game breakers. We could have had the ball all day today and didn’t look like scoring. That’s why we need our Ringroses and Stockdales in the team, without them we just don’t score tries. Earls was our only hope of scoring in our starting team today.

Yeah that’s pretty fair I think . Keenan was targeted by England and coped well without being either flawless or dominant under the high ball. I think he’ll continue you to improve but we need guys that can create space and make things happen in the backline.

[Flametop]

@ Shabba..Prozac is hellava drug.

[hermie]

Not a full of doom and gloom as most on here seem to be.

It was always going to be a struggle against that England pack - we all knew it.

1-8 we were well beaten and yet still showed guts all game long.

Anyone having a go at Doris needs their head checked, again - got hit by 2 man all game long but had the guts to just keep going.

While Ryan didn't have a great game he at least turned up physically on occasion.

I'm a big fan of Stander but thought he was completely anonymous today.

Still - blaming anyone is kinda nonsense, the England pack were on it from minute 1 and played really well.

Question is where do we go from here?

We need to find a beast of a losehead from somewhere - no idea where tbh. Similarly we need a big hooker - Sheehan might be that guy hopefully.

Hendo/Ryan are still a good enough second row for me.

Against bigger teams i'd be tempted to throw someone like Baird/Beirne in at 6 and Leavy in at 7. One of Doris/Stander at 8.

Thought JGP was ok - 1 brainfart aside and a few poor decisions. But he go zero protection from his pack.

Byrne at 10 was an absolute disaster - we badly need Harry or that gigner munster lad to put their hands up soon.

Outside 10 I thought our backs did about as well as they could, not perfect but when your 10 is taking the ball 15m behind the gainline life is never easy.

Anyway - hopefully we see a few new faces against Georgia and build well toward the 6N.

Don't think Farrell is anywhere near as bad as being made out. I'm relatively happy with him so far.

We are nowhere near the team that beat the AB's in 2018..we have been on the slide pretty much since then. That's just the reality. Farrell isn't the reason for that.

Not a bad assessment of the players but way too generous to the coaching staff

[earl the beaver]

Everything thrown at him?

Solid, certainly in comparison to Stockdale

Apart from the try yeah?

Stockdale last game he was our best back in attack and had a mistake leading to a try.

[Flametop]

Everything thrown at him?

Solid, certainly in comparison to Stockdale

Apart from the try yeah?

Stockdale last game he was our best back in attack and had a mistake leading to a try.

Never change bro.

[earl the beaver]

Everything thrown at him?

Solid, certainly in comparison to Stockdale

Apart from the try yeah?

Stockdale last game he was our best back in attack and had a mistake leading to a try.

Never change bro.

Stockdale was our best back in attack, I don't see any issue with saying that. And it's why we need him in the side and on the ball

[Bogbunny]

Everything thrown at him?

Solid, certainly in comparison to Stockdale

Apart from the try yeah?

Stockdale last game he was our best back in attack and had a mistake leading to a try.

And coughed up May's first try in line with the bored logic.

[hermie]

Everything thrown at him?

Solid, certainly in comparison to Stockdale

Apart from the try yeah?

Stockdale last game he was our best back in attack and had a mistake leading to a try.

The mistakes aren't comparable, nor the volume of errors. It's unbelievably one-eyed to even suggest that.

[cfm93]

How people are calling Doris soft is beyond, was getting swamped by 2 English defenders every time and still stayed in the fight.

Overall this is an easy game to analyse, Ireland outmatched physically and had no creativity in the backline to make up for it. I do think another 10 and Ringrose in the centre (and Farrell was better than Aki) makes this a very different match.

[earl the beaver]

Everything thrown at him?

Solid, certainly in comparison to Stockdale

Apart from the try yeah?

Stockdale last game he was our best back in attack and had a mistake leading to a try.

The mistakes aren't comparable, nor the volume of errors. It's unbelievably one-eyed to even suggest that.

I'm not saying stockdale didn't make more mistakes.

I'm saying you are ignoring the positives and overstating Keenan's

[Mr. Very Popular]

Stockdale is getting closer to that MOTM award yet.

[camroc1]

Not a full of doom and gloom as most on here seem to be.

It was always going to be a struggle against that England pack - we all knew it.

1-8 we were well beaten and yet still showed guts all game long.

Anyone having a go at Doris needs their head checked, again - got hit by 2 man all game long but had the guts to just keep going.

While Ryan didn't have a great game he at least turned up physically on occasion.

I'm a big fan of Stander but thought he was completely anonymous today.

Still - blaming anyone is kinda nonsense, the England pack were on it from minute 1 and played really well.

Question is where do we go from here?

We need to find a beast of a losehead from somewhere - no idea where tbh. Similarly we need a big hooker - Sheehan might be that guy hopefully.

Hendo/Ryan are still a good enough second row for me.

Against bigger teams i'd be tempted to throw someone like Baird/Beirne in at 6 and Leavy in at 7. One of Doris/Stander at 8.

Thought JGP was ok - 1 brainfart aside and a few poor decisions. But he go zero protection from his pack.

Byrne at 10 was an absolute disaster - we badly need Harry or that gigner munster lad to put their hands up soon.

Outside 10 I thought our backs did about as well as they could, not perfect but when your 10 is taking the ball 15m behind the gainline life is never easy.

Anyway - hopefully we see a few new faces against Georgia and build well toward the 6N.

Don't think Farrell is anywhere near as bad as being made out. I'm relatively happy with him so far.

We are nowhere near the team that beat the AB's in 2018..we have been on the slide pretty much since then. That's just the reality. Farrell isn't the reason for that.

Farrell isn't the reason we let May run the length of the pitch either.

[Bogbunny]

Stockdale is getting closer to that MOTM award yet.

Unfortunately none of the starters are in the race.

[Jim Lahey]

How can you be relatively happy with Farrell out of curiosity? IMO:

-He hasn’t changed our style to suit our strengths.
-He hasn’t addressed our complete lack of creativity in attack.
-He hasn’t improved our set piece.
-He hasn’t improved our defence.
-He hasn’t done very much in 7 games apart from stick to Joe’s preprogrammed attack and awful kicking game, which ultimately started failing spectacularly almost 2 years ago (after succeeding for quite some time beforehand).

We can give the man more time etc., but really, are we going to win a championship or even a Triple Crown under this man? Is he going to change our current gameplan to a winning one given that he needs to replace our linchpin at 10 in the next year or two?

I just don’t see it personally. I hope this post is re-quoted in 2 or 3 years time after some epic success to show me up for being completely wrong but I have seen nothing to-date to suggest he can turn us around.

[earl the beaver]

Stockdale is getting closer to that MOTM award yet.

[hermie]

How can you be relatively happy with Farrell out of curiosity? IMO:

-He hasn’t changed our style to suit our strengths.
-He hasn’t addressed our complete lack of creativity in attack.
-He hasn’t improved our set piece.
-He hasn’t improved our defence.
-He hasn’t done very much in 7 games apart from stick to Joe’s preprogrammed attack and awful kicking game, which ultimately started failing spectacularly almost 2 years ago (after succeeding for quite some time beforehand).

We can give the man more time etc., but really, are we going to win a championship or even a Triple Crown under this man? Is he going to change our current gameplan to a winning one given that he needs to replace our linchpin at 10 in the next year or two?

I just don’t see it personally. I hope this post is re-quoted in 2 or 3 years time after some epic success to show me up for being completely wrong but I have seen nothing to-date to suggest he can turn us around.

Yeah agree with much of that. The gameplan is noticeably different though to a certain extent. Less prescribed but far less accurate and not as strong at the ruck which was central to Schmidt's style.

[Trostan]

Stockdale has been shite. Why would he make any difference. Coming off the bench today he was a bit hungry so.maybe see how that goes. Overall and as many of us said a good while ago this is just a fallow few years ahead. We'll give Wales and Scotland a rattle and hide behind the couch for everybody else

He hasn't been shite though, he's made a some mistakes but he's also had some really good play. People are hounding him over his mistakes but when Lowe and Keenan make mistakes do we see the same reaction? Do we fúck.

He has been consistently shite for ages that is why he gets grief. I haven't gone after him you may or may not recall but he has still been shite. Keenan and Lowe aren't around long enough to be pilloried. The way the forwards are playing we'll be giving them gift for a few years to.come.

Keenan, along with Earl's was our best player today

Nope and nope

More nopes

[Mr. Very Popular]

For next week
Healy
Herring
Porter
Hendo
Beirne
CJ
Conors
Doris

Cooney
Burns

Stockdale
Aki
Farrell
Lowe
Keenan

I'd love to see a lot of the young fellas involved, Baird, Casey, Lowry would all bring something a bit different.

[hermie]

For next week
Healy
Herring
Porter
Hendo
Beirne
CJ
Conors
Doris

Cooney
Burns

Stockdale
Aki
Farrell
Lowe
Keenan

I'd love to see a lot of the young fellas involved, Baird, Casey, Lowry would all bring something a bit different.

Baird, Casey and Byrne simply have to be brought in.

[feckwanker]

All day England defenders were shooting up and it wasn't until about 10 mins to go that we tried to chip over the top of them.

We get absolutely destroyed at the breakdown everytime with England double tackling and losing turn-over ball and we never did a thing about it.

The annoying thing is that we always fail to adapt to the games we're playing in - we have plan A and that's it. Time and time again we do this.

We're a mediocre team that flatter to deceive.

Today was Byrne's litmus test and it gives me no pleasure to say that he failed. Our lineout was woeful. Our set piece was woeful.

Where's our aggression? Where are the gnarled plum in the pack? We're going nowhere fast....

[Bogbunny]

For next week
Healy
Herring
Porter
Hendo
Beirne
CJ
Conors
Doris

Cooney
Burns

Stockdale
Aki
Farrell
Lowe
Keenan

I'd love to see a lot of the young fellas involved, Baird, Casey, Lowry would all bring something a bit different.

Baird, Casey and Byrne simply have to be brought in.

No better game in the next 2 years to do it.

[feckwanker]

Also, despite his non- grounding of the ball, I thought Farrell was a great source of go forward ball all day. We could play much better if we get lads running off his shoulder when he's punching holes in defences.

[feckwanker]

For next week
Healy
Herring
Porter
Hendo
Beirne
CJ
Conors
Doris

Cooney
Burns

Stockdale
Aki
Farrell
Lowe
Keenan

I'd love to see a lot of the young fellas involved, Baird, Casey, Lowry would all bring something a bit different.

Baird, Casey and Byrne simply have to be brought in.

No better game in the next 2 years to do it.

While I agree, never going to happen. Central contracts, have to win ergo no risks, playing lads back into form, etc....

[Jumper]

For next week
Healy
Herring
Porter
Hendo
Beirne
CJ
Conors
Doris

Cooney
Burns

Stockdale
Aki
Farrell
Lowe
Keenan

I'd love to see a lot of the young fellas involved, Baird, Casey, Lowry would all bring something a bit different.

Baird, Casey and Byrne simply have to be brought in.

Yup. And Coombes too.

We need to start looking at guys with high ceilings, and move away from stop gaps.

If there are high-potential younger guys available, they should be involved - Ruddock and probably Cooney miss out as a result. Where there are no high-potential young guys, we might need stop gaps - maybe the likes of James Cronin.

Kelleher probably needs to be persisted with at hooker. An intelligent lock to call the lineout would help him no end.

[Jumper]

Also, despite his non- grounding of the ball, I thought Farrell was a great source of go forward ball all day. We could play much better if we get lads running off his shoulder when he's punching holes in defences.

He was a bit one-dimensional, but he was basically our only source of go-forward in that second half.

[grimoald]

For the good of Ireland Leinster need to move on from Ross Byrne as soon as possible. Yes other provinces should be developing players, but we are where we are.

Keenan is a good tidy player, but he's not someone you should be planning to have in the team long-term.

I also do slightly wonder about player conditioning. It's all well and good dominating collision in the Pro14, but to reach their potential the likes of Doris and Kelleher should be looking to put on another 4 or 5kg each minimum.

Against bigger teams i'd be tempted to throw someone like Baird/Beirne in at 6 and Leavy in at 7. One of Doris/Stander at 8.

I agree with this. Also while our 10 stocks are as they are, I'd have Murray covering 10 so we can get an extra forward on the bench.

[EverReady]

Stockdale is getting closer to that MOTM award yet.

The provincial bias just sickens my hole. The only consistently neutral members are you and I MVP and we both know all the Prods are shite

[Mr. Very Popular]

For next week
Healy
Herring
Porter
Hendo
Beirne
CJ
Conors
Doris

Cooney
Burns

Stockdale
Aki
Farrell
Lowe
Keenan

I'd love to see a lot of the young fellas involved, Baird, Casey, Lowry would all bring something a bit different.

Baird, Casey and Byrne simply have to be brought in.

A team I'd like to see, just for the madness of it

Healy
Kevin O Brien ( his time is coming)
Porter
Dillane
Baird
Doris
Conors
Coombes

Casey
Byrne the Junior

Lowe
Lowry
Farrell
Stockdale
Keenan.

And just let them play ball.

[Mr. Very Popular]

Stockdale is getting closer to that MOTM award yet.

The provincial bias just sickens my hole. The only consistently neutral members are you and I MVP and we both know all the Prods are shite

We're like God's of truth.

[shabadoo]

How can you be relatively happy with Farrell out of curiosity? IMO:

-He hasn’t changed our style to suit our strengths.
-He hasn’t addressed our complete lack of creativity in attack.
-He hasn’t improved our set piece.
-He hasn’t improved our defence.
-He hasn’t done very much in 7 games apart from stick to Joe’s preprogrammed attack and awful kicking game, which ultimately started failing spectacularly almost 2 years ago (after succeeding for quite some time beforehand).

We can give the man more time etc., but really, are we going to win a championship or even a Triple Crown under this man? Is he going to change our current gameplan to a winning one given that he needs to replace our linchpin at 10 in the next year or two?

I just don’t see it personally. I hope this post is re-quoted in 2 or 3 years time after some epic success to show me up for being completely wrong but I have seen nothing to-date to suggest he can turn us around.

Don't agree with a lot of that. I think he has absolutely addressed our creativity in attack for a start.

Given he has an aging Sexton and sfa outside of that he has done pretty well.

I just like the attitude he seems to bring to the team. They were well beaten today by a significantly superior team but showed the kind of guts I want to see. I think Farrell should take some credit for that.

Anyway - very early days yet and you might well be right...but i'm happy with him for now.

[Hellraiser]

How can you be relatively happy with Farrell out of curiosity? IMO:

-He hasn’t changed our style to suit our strengths.
-He hasn’t addressed our complete lack of creativity in attack.
-He hasn’t improved our set piece.
-He hasn’t improved our defence.
-He hasn’t done very much in 7 games apart from stick to Joe’s preprogrammed attack and awful kicking game, which ultimately started failing spectacularly almost 2 years ago (after succeeding for quite some time beforehand).

We can give the man more time etc., but really, are we going to win a championship or even a Triple Crown under this man? Is he going to change our current gameplan to a winning one given that he needs to replace our linchpin at 10 in the next year or two?

I just don’t see it personally. I hope this post is re-quoted in 2 or 3 years time after some epic success to show me up for being completely wrong but I have seen nothing to-date to suggest he can turn us around.

Yeah agree with much of that. The gameplan is noticeably different though to a certain extent. Less prescribed but far less accurate and not as strong at the ruck which was central to Schmidt's style.

The core rot is the same. Utter predictability due to complete lack of creativity, which was always the fatal flaw in Schmidt's system. The problem isn't that teams have worked us out, it's that In the space of two years Schmidt's playing system has not just become totally obsolete, it's that it's become an active recipe for failure, because it's not something that can be successfully adapted to a heads up, creative gameplan.

[Jumper]

While we're unlikely to have new guys brought into the squad for this game, it would be great to see something like:

Cronin, Kelleher, Porter; - LH is a big worry in the medium term.
Henderson (c), Beirne;
Baird, Doris, Connors:

JGP, H. Byrne;
Aki, Farrell; - it's unispiring, but I don't think we need to blood options in the centre.
Lowe, Daly, Stockdale.

Bench:
O'Byrne - It's a stop-gap, but he's a baller.
Herring
O'Toole - Are there any other options?
Wycherly
Coombes
Casey
Burns
Keenan

(/adjust for your own flavour of bias as needed)

[shabadoo]

@ Shabba..Prozac is hellava drug.

Ah fuck all the gloomy bollox. We were not that bad - and we will improve.

England were/are a much more settled team - they had everything in their favour.

It is nowhere near as bad as people are making out.

I think we will be grand come 6N time.

Won the 2nd half and you are only as good as your last half - so technically we are already better than the cunts

[Hellraiser]

How can you be relatively happy with Farrell out of curiosity? IMO:

-He hasn’t changed our style to suit our strengths.
-He hasn’t addressed our complete lack of creativity in attack.
-He hasn’t improved our set piece.
-He hasn’t improved our defence.
-He hasn’t done very much in 7 games apart from stick to Joe’s preprogrammed attack and awful kicking game, which ultimately started failing spectacularly almost 2 years ago (after succeeding for quite some time beforehand).

We can give the man more time etc., but really, are we going to win a championship or even a Triple Crown under this man? Is he going to change our current gameplan to a winning one given that he needs to replace our linchpin at 10 in the next year or two?

I just don’t see it personally. I hope this post is re-quoted in 2 or 3 years time after some epic success to show me up for being completely wrong but I have seen nothing to-date to suggest he can turn us around.

Don't agree with a lot of that. I think he has absolutely addressed our creativity in attack for a start.

Given he has an aging Sexton and sfa outside of that he has done pretty well.

I just like the attitude he seems to bring to the team. They were well beaten today by a significantly superior team but showed the kind of guts I want to see. I think Farrell should take some credit for that.

Anyway - very early days yet and you might well be right...but i'm happy with him for now.

Are you high?

[Jim Lahey]

@ Shabba..Prozac is hellava drug.

Ah fuck all the gloomy bollox. We were not that bad - and we will improve.

England were/are a much more settled team - they had everything in their favour.

It is nowhere near as bad as people are making out.

I think we will be grand come 6N time.

Won the 2nd half and you are only as good as your last half - so technically we are already better than the cunts

Define grand.
4th?

[shabadoo]

How can you be relatively happy with Farrell out of curiosity? IMO:

-He hasn’t changed our style to suit our strengths.
-He hasn’t addressed our complete lack of creativity in attack.
-He hasn’t improved our set piece.
-He hasn’t improved our defence.
-He hasn’t done very much in 7 games apart from stick to Joe’s preprogrammed attack and awful kicking game, which ultimately started failing spectacularly almost 2 years ago (after succeeding for quite some time beforehand).

We can give the man more time etc., but really, are we going to win a championship or even a Triple Crown under this man? Is he going to change our current gameplan to a winning one given that he needs to replace our linchpin at 10 in the next year or two?

I just don’t see it personally. I hope this post is re-quoted in 2 or 3 years time after some epic success to show me up for being completely wrong but I have seen nothing to-date to suggest he can turn us around.

Don't agree with a lot of that. I think he has absolutely addressed our creativity in attack for a start.

Given he has an aging Sexton and sfa outside of that he has done pretty well.

I just like the attitude he seems to bring to the team. They were well beaten today by a significantly superior team but showed the kind of guts I want to see. I think Farrell should take some credit for that.

Anyway - very early days yet and you might well be right...but i'm happy with him for now.

Are you high?

Not at the moment, no.

[Jim Lahey]

Your final point deserves more attention tbf.
We won 7-0 when he brought on the Ulster players.

[shabadoo]

@ Shabba..Prozac is hellava drug.

Ah fuck all the gloomy bollox. We were not that bad - and we will improve.

England were/are a much more settled team - they had everything in their favour.

It is nowhere near as bad as people are making out.

I think we will be grand come 6N time.

Won the 2nd half and you are only as good as your last half - so technically we are already better than the cunts

Define grand.
4th?

3/5 is grand
4/5 would be good

[shabadoo]

Your final point deserves more attention tbf.
We won 7-0 when he brought on the Ulster players.

Hendo looked good when he came on tbf. And Burns, who I have been shitting all over, played a brazillion times better than Byrne

[Trostan]

@ Shabba..Prozac is hellava drug.

Ah fuck all the gloomy bollox. We were not that bad - and we will improve.

England were/are a much more settled team - they had everything in their favour.

It is nowhere near as bad as people are making out.

I think we will be grand come 6N time.

Won the 2nd half and you are only as good as your last half - so technically we are already better than the cunts

England won because
They had 230 almost perfect tackles.
They humbled us with their physicality, aggression and defence.
As an attacking team, they are no better than us, except Farrell's Cross kicks are better.

We need some aggression and spite in the forwards back 5 and some creativity from 10 to 13